May 18, 2011 at 9:15 pm
Comments posted to this topic are about the item The Three Percent Difference
May 19, 2011 at 1:54 am
Well I for one would be happy to be getting $75,000 (GBP46,450) and even happier if I thought it would go up by a minimum of 2% just for keeping out of trouble.
At last year's review, a major ePayments system for one of our clients had just gone live successfully, a development in which I played a major part. My reward for my work on what had been a difficult project was a pay rise of precisely 0%. Oh, yes, and my final salary pension was replaced by a defined contribution pension. I scored 100% in my ITIL certification exam the same year.
That was just one of 6 barren years since 2003.
My advice? If you want to work hard and do the best job you can, do so for your own satisfaction. Don't
do so for the vague prospect of financial reward at the end of the year because you are very likely to be disappointed.
Where I work, the review process is highly proceduralised, and any discretion which your immediate manager (who actually knows what you achieved) might have had, has been thoroughly excised.
I try not to think about the money, because it make me feel bitter. However, I have an endless curiosity to find out new things, and use that to produce something useful.
May 19, 2011 at 2:41 am
john.riley-1111039 (5/19/2011)
Well I for one would be happy to be getting $75,000 (GBP46,450) and even happier if I thought it would go up by a minimum of 2% just for keeping out of trouble.
SO with you on that one--due to a redundancy my salary has effectively dropped by £10,000 in the last three years, and even before that it was nowhere near that $75,000 figure! Part of that's being a more general sysadmin than a SQL specialist, admittedly, but I would kill to work for a company where I could just be a "bench warmer" and get a guaranteed 2% annual pay rise...
May 19, 2011 at 3:04 am
If you've all read "Drive" as recommened by Steve Jones (thanks, Steve!), you'll know that this discussion is moot 😀
But, just to chip in, given the figures mentioned I'd say there is no financial incentive to be anything other than a "bench warmer".
May 19, 2011 at 4:25 am
Without making it complicated by compounding the raises...
...except that that's the important bit. The incentives in the short term are fairly small, but the compounding really starts to kick in later on. After 5 years, if you can maintain your "top dog" raises, your salary will be just 15% greater than the bench-warmer's, and after 10 years it'll be about a third greater. However, at 14 years you're earning a full 50% more than them, and at 25 years you've doubled your salary compared with them.
I say "compared with them", but it's more "compared with yourself under different circumstances". I'd say retiring at a salary more than double what it could be is worth the extra bit of effort, and let's not forget that salaries are often part of a grading structure, so your higher retirement salary may well also come with other benefits commensurate with higher grades.
Semper in excretia, suus solum profundum variat
May 19, 2011 at 5:38 am
Now, this may sound naive...but do you work hard to get the raise or do you work hard because it is its own reward. Sure, getting a nice raise is welcome and who wouldn't want to make a lot of money for their efforts? But, would you take a job in a different field that you didn't care for if it paid a larger salary? I've yet to find anyone who mad a decision based solely on money that turned out well.
Or...do you work hard because you love the work? If you do, you won't be able to be a "bench warmer" and it is from this inner drive that you end up at the front of the pack. It is also that inner drive that gives you the reward of knowing you did good work. Now, if you work for a company that can't reward that type of effort, it's a big world, build up your resume and keep your eyes open for a company that does.
However, all of that said, I'm not talking about the scenario where you are clearly the "alpha dog", but someone else is getting rewarded because they play the political games. That is an entirely different scenario and discussion.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
When you realize you've dug yourself into a hole....Step 1...stop digging.
May 19, 2011 at 6:42 am
The Three Percent Difference, that's laughable in my case. How about the 4.1 percent difference. I got a .98 percent raise this year, to add the to that, the company I work for is doing fantastic. So fantastic they are hiring temps so they can complete projects on time. The Three Percent Difference, LOL...
May 19, 2011 at 7:38 am
ChazMan (5/19/2011)
Now, this may sound naive...but do you work hard to get the raise or do you work hard because it is its own reward. Sure, getting a nice raise is welcome and who wouldn't want to make a lot of money for their efforts? But, would you take a job in a different field that you didn't care for if it paid a larger salary? I've yet to find anyone who mad a decision based solely on money that turned out well.Or...do you work hard because you love the work? If you do, you won't be able to be a "bench warmer" and it is from this inner drive that you end up at the front of the pack. It is also that inner drive that gives you the reward of knowing you did good work. Now, if you work for a company that can't reward that type of effort, it's a big world, build up your resume and keep your eyes open for a company that does.
However, all of that said, I'm not talking about the scenario where you are clearly the "alpha dog", but someone else is getting rewarded because they play the political games. That is an entirely different scenario and discussion.
Chaz hits it on the head here. You gotta love your job. I had a career in aviation maintenance where my salary increased about 20% over 13 years. I did not love the job but it paid the bills... mostly 🙂
Then I realized that I was doing many IT tasks as part of my helicopter mechanic job and many of my colleagues kept commenting on how I should be a computer guy. I had been "playing with computers" since I was a teenager in the late 70's, but I had never considered a career in IT.
So I quit my job, went to school. Over the course of several months and after going through thousands of pages and hundreds of labs in Self-Paced books at an IT school, I ended up with a handful of certifications. My first job, after 8 months of unemployment because of the dot com bubble bust, was making 30% LESS than my last job. But I loved it, dug in, proved myself and got an offer at 20% HIGHER than my former career. Since then (8 years ago), my base salary has increased by 90% not even counting bonuses which make my total income about 150% higher than my old career.
Plateaued you may say? Nope. Actually, I just received a base salary offer 25% higher than my current salary. But it requires a major move and it would be a break even with my current total compensation. But it was tempting to be offered such a high base. And I get these kinds of opportunities once or twice a month.
Why does this happen? 2 main reasons.
1. Every job I have, I strive to be the best employee they ever had. I am not 100% successful at that but I get close.
2. I am constantly learning and re-certifying. I have 3 generations of certifications now and I am going wider as well as deeper. Education and certification are a huge part of my success. And I see this working for many of my colleagues at my current company.
3. Ok, a third reason. I wake up every morning looking forward to going to work. If you don't, find another job. Seriously.
And I mentor alot of IT people now, after having been an instructor for a few years. I love to help others build success. I feel very lucky to do what I enjoy.
Peter Trast
Microsoft Certified ...(insert many literal strings here)
Microsoft Design Architect with Alexander Open Systems
May 19, 2011 at 7:39 am
I tend to believe that one should try to be much more than a "bench-warmer". Yes many companies do not seem to recognize employee contributions when review time comes around. However, You can always mention such efforts in your resume or use a coworker as a reference. It's unfortunate that in order to get a decent raise, you often need to "jump ship".
I just got myself a 58% increase in pay when I left a company I had been with for 4 years. My last company had a cap on raises of 1% a year, and that was implemented after 3 years of wage freezes. For those 4 years however I was quite happy. Even given the monetary situation. The work we did helped people, and often saved lives. For me the decision to leave was made by a desire for a greater challenge, a need to further my career and knowledge, and needing to have money to save for my wedding next winter.
May 19, 2011 at 7:48 am
I think permanent/salaried jobs are neither fair nor efficient. Most people should work as contractors and paid hourly.
%3 difference? I think a DBA can make %100 difference and should earn double in that case.
Also, I think salaried jobs should not be fixed. Their salary should be based on company performance with min/max limits. It can be $50K one year when company is not doing good, but it should/could be $150K when it's good so that permanent workers can get better share from the pie. I am sure pie will be bigger when responsibilities are shared.
There should be more millionaires but less billionaires (especially millions of people live in hunger)
The current permanent job system is very close to slavery.
May 19, 2011 at 7:54 am
I've gone from $7.50/hour in 2001 to, well HR says I can't say the number but it's more than 4X that. None of it has been through percentage raises during an annual review process. It's by getting progressively better jobs at progressively better employers. My next strategic step, if I feel the need for it, would be towards Senior BI Architect, and the pay increase for that would be about 30% over what I'm making now. It'll take a while, since there are a few skills I simply don't have yet. There's also a fairly high probability I'll never bother, since I love my current job, and a bit more money would be nice but wouldn't be worth moving to a new employer for.
So, no, I haven't paid any attention to a 3% difference. Not yet, and probably won't ever.
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
Property of The Thread
"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon
May 19, 2011 at 8:00 am
GSquared (5/19/2011)
I've gone from $7.50/hour in 2001 to, well HR says I can't say the number but it's more than 4X that. None of it has been through percentage raises during an annual review process. It's by getting progressively better jobs at progressively better employers. My next strategic step, if I feel the need for it, would be towards Senior BI Architect, and the pay increase for that would be about 30% over what I'm making now. It'll take a while, since there are a few skills I simply don't have yet. There's also a fairly high probability I'll never bother, since I love my current job, and a bit more money would be nice but wouldn't be worth moving to a new employer for.So, no, I haven't paid any attention to a 3% difference. Not yet, and probably won't ever.
Awesome 300$ / hour. 😉
May 19, 2011 at 8:09 am
Ninja's_RGR'us (5/19/2011)
GSquared (5/19/2011)
I've gone from $7.50/hour in 2001 to, well HR says I can't say the number but it's more than 4X that. None of it has been through percentage raises during an annual review process. It's by getting progressively better jobs at progressively better employers. My next strategic step, if I feel the need for it, would be towards Senior BI Architect, and the pay increase for that would be about 30% over what I'm making now. It'll take a while, since there are a few skills I simply don't have yet. There's also a fairly high probability I'll never bother, since I love my current job, and a bit more money would be nice but wouldn't be worth moving to a new employer for.So, no, I haven't paid any attention to a 3% difference. Not yet, and probably won't ever.
Awesome 300$ / hour. 😉
You need a better desktop calculator.
7.5x4 < 300
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
Property of The Thread
"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon
May 19, 2011 at 8:11 am
GSquared (5/19/2011)
Ninja's_RGR'us (5/19/2011)
GSquared (5/19/2011)
I've gone from $7.50/hour in 2001 to, well HR says I can't say the number but it's more than 4X that. None of it has been through percentage raises during an annual review process. It's by getting progressively better jobs at progressively better employers. My next strategic step, if I feel the need for it, would be towards Senior BI Architect, and the pay increase for that would be about 30% over what I'm making now. It'll take a while, since there are a few skills I simply don't have yet. There's also a fairly high probability I'll never bother, since I love my current job, and a bit more money would be nice but wouldn't be worth moving to a new employer for.So, no, I haven't paid any attention to a 3% difference. Not yet, and probably won't ever.
Awesome 300$ / hour. 😉
You need a better desktop calculator.
7.5x4 < 300
Darn, I thought you meant to hide the last digit of the multiplication. 😀
May 19, 2011 at 8:17 am
Ninja's_RGR'us (5/19/2011)
GSquared (5/19/2011)
Ninja's_RGR'us (5/19/2011)
GSquared (5/19/2011)
I've gone from $7.50/hour in 2001 to, well HR says I can't say the number but it's more than 4X that. None of it has been through percentage raises during an annual review process. It's by getting progressively better jobs at progressively better employers. My next strategic step, if I feel the need for it, would be towards Senior BI Architect, and the pay increase for that would be about 30% over what I'm making now. It'll take a while, since there are a few skills I simply don't have yet. There's also a fairly high probability I'll never bother, since I love my current job, and a bit more money would be nice but wouldn't be worth moving to a new employer for.So, no, I haven't paid any attention to a 3% difference. Not yet, and probably won't ever.
Awesome 300$ / hour. 😉
You need a better desktop calculator.
7.5x4 < 300
Darn, I thought you meant to hide the last digit of the multiplication. 😀
Oooohhhh, I wish!
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
Property of The Thread
"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon
Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 44 total)
You must be logged in to reply to this topic. Login to reply