Talking baseball
-
Not looking to disrupt the game, but I like the game. There are things in some games, from the past, where players deliberately went to injure others. I think the head hits in football, like Deacon Jones slapping heads, just don't work as players have gotten much, much stronger.
Not a hockey fan, so I can't comment much. I don't mind checking, and am not familiar enough to know what's out of bounds.
I think blocking the plate without the ball just invites injury. Taking out a guy at 2nd with a wide slide, or a high slide, isn't really part of baseball. It's become part of the game, but at most levels we don't allow it. Throwing at a guy is really out of bounds, in my mind. It's just nasty and dangerous, and unnecessary.
-
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (5/16/2016)
Not a hockey fan, so I can't comment much. I don't mind checking, and am not familiar enough to know what's out of bounds.There's no true "out of bounds" in hockey. The only time (in that sense) when something is out of bounds is when the puck leaves the playing area (i.e. goes above the glass, goes into the crowd, etc.).
I think blocking the plate without the ball just invites injury. Taking out a guy at 2nd with a wide slide, or a high slide, isn't really part of baseball. It's become part of the game, but at most levels we don't allow it. Throwing at a guy is really out of bounds, in my mind. It's just nasty and dangerous, and unnecessary.
I'll go along with this. It's one thing to send a message, but to go out of your way to actually hurt someone is uncalled for. I think that warrants an automatic ejection, and maybe even a suspension and/or fine.
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Check out my blog at https://pianorayk.wordpress.com/ -
Ray K (5/10/2016)
Anyone going to SQL Saturday in Rochester this Saturday? Would love to talk baseball with some of you guys in person!I'm doing two presentations; I'll even wear my Yankees jersey while I give them! :hehe:
In case anyone was wondering (or cared), yes, I did wear my jersey while presenting on Saturday! 🙂
Alas, nobody asked me about it. Oh well.
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Check out my blog at https://pianorayk.wordpress.com/ -
Sorry, not out of bounds for the puck. Out of bounds for behavior. When is checking dirty? No idea.
-
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (5/16/2016)
Sorry, not out of bounds for the puck. Out of bounds for behavior. When is checking dirty? No idea.There are penalties for certain types of checking, including checking from behind, checking with a stick (cross-checking), and over-forcefully checking someone into the boards (boarding). There are a lot of rules similarities to football (nothing around the head, for example). Not entirely sure as to what the rules say constitute some of the checking penalties, and although I watch a lot of hockey (I have season tickets for RPI college hockey), maybe someone who understands these rules can explain them better than I can.
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Check out my blog at https://pianorayk.wordpress.com/ -
Tim Mitchell (5/16/2016)
Grumpy DBA (5/16/2016)
Tim Mitchell (5/16/2016)
Not excusing the punch, but I suspect it had to do more with Bautista's dirty and dangerous slide than the celebratory bat toss.Bautista did what baseball players have been taught for decades: slide hard, break up the double play. He slid over the bag, so he did not go outside of the basepath to take out Odor. It was a good old hard-nosed slide, the way baseball should be played. The current wussification of the sport is ridiculous.
We'll have to just disagree on this point. If the game can be made safer by prohibiting the runner from purposefully using his feet as weapons, I'm all for it.
They have made the rule change to where a late slide (Bautista slid late) or out of base path slide is an auto DP.
I don't think the Bautista slide was egregious but obviously late. Odor had cleared him easily without contact. As it turns out the infield had chatted and were ready for a confrontation. Odor just happened to start it.
In other considerations - 8 players overall ejected. There is just general bad blood all around from the bat flip. I don't have a problem with the bat flip.
I don't have a problem with a pitcher dinging a batter either. Chin music is a part of the game, accidental HBP is a part of the game. We all know that a pitcher will come after a player every once in a while and remind the batter with a well placed ball into his side or back. If the pitcher does it again and again - toss him. That is an obvious behavior that needs to be addressed. In the case of this HBP, I think it is lame for Bush to wait until the last time the Rangers will see Bautista this regular season to throw at him. If you are going to do that (as is traditionally done to air the differences) do it early in the series and be done with it.
Anybody that has been HBP understands it stings a little and goes away. It hurts far worse to get dinged by a ball after it has been hit - and the pain from that wears off too. I think Bautista could have avoided the HBP, but too much machismo in MLB prevents many of them from dodging the pitch (no effort by Bautista to move indicates he can take the pain from the pitched ball).
Flip the coin a bit, it was hysterical to watch Odor follow the punch with a glove slap. Bautista did look like he was readying to throw an open fisted punch - according to some. Maybe he was just getting reading to block the glove hand. Either way he was slow. The glove slap was still funny. That's like a linebacker throwing a punch at a player wearing a football helmet.
Did Odor have a chance to be the bigger player on a non-contact play? He sure did. He knew (based on infield chatter and the fact that Bautista was HBP), that a late slide was highly probable. That knowledge can be further assumed by his quick jump to avoid the slide and avoid all contact.
Did Bautista have a chance to be the bigger play and slide a bit earlier? He sure did. In his defense, he was in the base path, there was no obvious intent (such as spikes up or a leg lift) to cause injury. Either way, his late slide forced the DP to be called due to interference.
In the end, at least Bautista owned it while Odor could not be found for comment
One last thing. Notice that Odor dropped his arm slot considerably trying to ding Bautista again with the throw to first? It seemed pretty obvious that his arm was dropped abnormally as if trying to go after Bautista again instead of just making the DP. Given that he likely figured an interference was going to be called (again he was expecting the late hard slide) then why not head hunt after Joey Bats again?
In short, grown men from both sides acted stupidly and they could have changed it. It is for those reasons, in large part, that 8 ejections occurred in that game.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events -
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (5/16/2016)
Taking out a guy at 2nd with a wide slide, or a high slide, isn't really part of baseball. It's become part of the game, but at most levels we don't allow it. Throwing at a guy is really out of bounds, in my mind. It's just nasty and dangerous, and unnecessary.Wide, high, cleats up, leg whip, or anything else outside the realms of a normal slide to be safe at a base is now deemed interference. The interfering player and batter are both out now. It is very costly to the team to try and take a man out at a bag this year (new rule change in effect this year).
I agree on the side of the new slide rule.
It used to be that these "slides" were an effort to delay or break up a DP. The slides got further and further away from a baseball play that they had to do something to protect (mostly) the middle infielders.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events -
Ray K (5/16/2016)
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (5/16/2016)
Sorry, not out of bounds for the puck. Out of bounds for behavior. When is checking dirty? No idea.There are penalties for certain types of checking, including checking from behind, checking with a stick (cross-checking), and over-forcefully checking someone into the boards (boarding). There are a lot of rules similarities to football (nothing around the head, for example). Not entirely sure as to what the rules say constitute some of the checking penalties, and although I watch a lot of hockey (I have season tickets for RPI college hockey), maybe someone who understands these rules can explain them better than I can.
Generally, most checking is OK, the penalties get assessed when the check is egregious (cross-checking, boarding.) You'll see a lot of penalties for a "fair" check when the player being checked had no way to defend against the check.
Another "dirty" check is when it occurs away from the play, say for example the puck is down at the home teams end, all but a couple players are down by the puck, and someone from the away team checks a home team player.
-
Rougned Odor gets 8-game suspension for punching Jose Bautista
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Check out my blog at https://pianorayk.wordpress.com/ -
Seems light, but it is what it is. What would this be in the NBA? 4 games? 8?
In the NFL? I'd think a direct punch like that would be 2 or 4 games, which equates to 32+ games.
-
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (5/17/2016)
Seems light, but it is what it is.I thought eight games seemed a bit light myself.
Walked into our break room a few minutes ago, where there's a TV and it was on Mike & Mike. Apparently there was something last night where the Oakland A's hit a walk-off grand slam vs. Texas. As the guy rounds the bases, he took his helmet -- and didn't just take it off, as per walk-off custom, but did a "jump shot" with it into his crowd of teammates at home plate.
The debate was, how is this not showing up the pitcher? What makes this different than Joey Bautista's bat flip?
Personally, I don't have an opinion one way or another, but I thought it was interesting that they brought it up.
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
Check out my blog at https://pianorayk.wordpress.com/ -
Pointing at the fence, maybe watching the ball go. These are celebrating. I thought I read somewhere this guy used to celebrate after hitting, before or after running
-
I'm more of an NFL guy so maybe it's hard to compare. I mean thanks to TO and his antics (sharpie, Dallas Star, etc...) the league had to institute penalties for excessive celebration. Compared to that stuff I personally never saw why Bautista's bat flip was such a big deal. It was a big game and a big moment with lots of emotion. How is that any different than when a pitcher does a fist pump when he gets a big out. Isn't that like showing up the batter?
But like I said I'm more of a football guy so what do I know...now if only somebody can explain to me how damn contracts in MLB work I might not tank my franchise in 'MLB The Show'. :crazy:
SELECT quote FROM brain WHERE original = 1
0 rows returned -
Contracts in baseball, AFAIK, are real contracts. Can't get out of them even if you cut the guy. I think a player retiring is the only way they void. Same for the NBA, IIRC.
-
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (5/18/2016)
Contracts in baseball, AFAIK, are real contracts. Can't get out of them even if you cut the guy. I think a player retiring is the only way they void. Same for the NBA, IIRC.Ok, I walked into that one...considering NFL contracts are probably the most complex in any sport. I guess the part I don't get is usually around minor leagues, moving up, arbitration etc... It's the little nuances when dealing with newer players. I don't know the lingo so I'm probably not explaining it right.
SELECT quote FROM brain WHERE original = 1
0 rows returned
Viewing 15 posts - 1,651 through 1,665 (of 1,972 total)
You must be logged in to reply to this topic. Login to reply