May 25, 2016 at 9:25 pm
Comments posted to this topic are about the item Should I Stay or Go?
May 26, 2016 at 1:52 am
Good article.
It reminds me that for a very long time, I wasn't that interested in SQL dev, Business Intelligence, etc. I had a very expensive and demanding hobby and I had found a job that paid relatively well part-time. At that time, it would have never crossed my mind (and actually it didn't) to go to a SQL conference or even study in my own time to become better at T-SQL or learning about SSIS, etc. So I stayed 7 years at the same job. But then, my hobby become too expensive to carry on (= wife not happy :-D) so I focused on what I was doing at work and put my energy in learning SSRS ,SSIS, SSAS, etc even during the holiday (remember being on the beach with my tablet and perusing a book on DW and on Business Intelligence). I then moved to a job that was supposed to fasten my progress: I worked in a small financial institution with very nice others more experienced BI Devs. But I left very quickly (6 month later) because the transfer of knowledge was much slower that I anticipated. Being in a team is nice but I hated being constraint in my learning environment (yes, I actually left a firm because the over zealous I.T. manager blocked any internet access to blogs!). The work/learning mix was very low (more than 90% work).
Instead I choose a place were people were nice but didn't know much about BI. On the other hand, they let me learn on site whatever was needed to do my job and I have access to any resource I want. 2 years on and I'm still enjoying this unique position. I'm still learning. So I'm happy 🙂 When the job will be so busy that I won't be able to learn anymore, I will then reassess my options. For me, a good place of work, is one that offer the right mix of work and learning. And for me, the right mix is : 60% work and 40% learning/experimenting. So if the work go up to 80% for several month, then I will seriously reassess my options.
May 26, 2016 at 3:39 am
Andy, as you have mentioned there are so many factors involved, and every person will have a different view.
I always use Herzberg’s two-factor theory as a starting point during these types of discussions ().
The harsh reality is that the goal of any company is to make a profit and to create wealth for the shareholders.
Your company’s goals might not always be in line with your personal goals.
That does not necessarily mean that you will not get job satisfaction.
I have heard about a well-known company where many employees have complained in public about the working conditions; yet, new employees are literary trampling over each other to get job interviews.
Personally I believe that when the job becomes too repetitive and you are not learning anything new, it might be time to start looking elsewhere.
May 26, 2016 at 7:27 am
It sounds like the same thought process I went through when I finally came to the decision to leave my marriage.
May 26, 2016 at 7:56 am
I'm thinking about this in the content of technology choices.
I use mostly Microsoft technology at my current job and Linux at home. But I have two opportunities to jump fully into different development stacks, both which are mature and cross platform. Even with all the openness from Redmond concerning .NET and free VS and development copies of SQL Server, I'm still concerned about all the technology they have orphaned in my career, the debacle of Windows Phone 10, (I currently love my Nokia 1020), and the sheer stupid arrogance in forced Windows 10 "upgrades".
So I'll keep a Windows machine or two in the house for the spouse and applications that absolutely require it, stay current enough to be use Microsoft technology, but the passion for it is gone.
May 26, 2016 at 8:00 am
I was at one job for nine years and after some frustrating setbacks with no management support, I decided to quit. When I told my friends, they said "Oh, you haven't been happy there for a long time." THEN WHY DIDN'T YOU MENTION THIS!
Currently I'm in a position where I was informed on Monday that my contract is not going to be renewed at the end of the June for the new fiscal year. Even though I knew I was technically under contract, it was considered a formality that it would be renewed. Contrary to what me, my current boss, and my previous boss thought and were told, apparently it was just for the project that I'm developing. Never mind that they have other SQL Servers that I've never been given access to make sure they're being backed up reliably and can be restored. I guess it's definitely not my problem.
C'est la vie. It'll give me time off over the summer that I really need. I guess if they want changes to the system that they'll have to negotiate a new contract, and it will be at a somewhat higher rate.
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[font="Arial"]Knowledge is of two kinds. We know a subject ourselves or we know where we can find information upon it. --Samuel Johnson[/font]
May 26, 2016 at 8:18 am
Stefan LG (5/26/2016)
Andy, as you have mentioned there are so many factors involved, and every person will have a different view.I always use Herzberg’s two-factor theory as a starting point during these types of discussions ().
The harsh reality is that the goal of any company is to make a profit and to create wealth for the shareholders.
Your company’s goals might not always be in line with your personal goals.
That does not necessarily mean that you will not get job satisfaction.
I have heard about a well-known company where many employees have complained in public about the working conditions; yet, new employees are literary trampling over each other to get job interviews.
Personally I believe that when the job becomes too repetitive and you are not learning anything new, it might be time to start looking elsewhere.
Clearly you've never worked in the public sector. In the public sector the goal is self-preservation. For many there's also being a public service.
Kindest Regards, Rod Connect with me on LinkedIn.
May 26, 2016 at 8:20 am
Wayne West (5/26/2016)
I was at one job for nine years and after some frustrating setbacks with no management support, I decided to quit. When I told my friends, they said "Oh, you haven't been happy there for a long time." THEN WHY DIDN'T YOU MENTION THIS!Currently I'm in a position where I was informed on Monday that my contract is not going to be renewed at the end of the June for the new fiscal year. Even though I knew I was technically under contract, it was considered a formality that it would be renewed. Contrary to what me, my current boss, and my previous boss thought and were told, apparently it was just for the project that I'm developing. Never mind that they have other SQL Servers that I've never been given access to make sure they're being backed up reliably and can be restored. I guess it's definitely not my problem.
C'est la vie. It'll give me time off over the summer that I really need. I guess if they want changes to the system that they'll have to negotiate a new contract, and it will be at a somewhat higher rate.
Wayne, I'm very sorry to hear this. Haven't gone through this myself not too long ago, I really feel for you. I've got a lot of resources I could share with you from when I was unemployed. Just let me know if you'd like me to share.
Kindest Regards, Rod Connect with me on LinkedIn.
May 26, 2016 at 8:54 am
My current employment situation took a very bad turn a while back but I survived and today things are much better.
However, when the job was not going well, I tried looking for another job. I even had interviews where the second on-site interview went well or extremely well, but no job offer. This happened enough that I have revised my resume to remove half of my job experience and I removed all other dates (degrees and training) because I truly believe the problem was age discrimination (obviously I am older) and my mistake was to 'date' myself.
It is hard to move on when you encounter such a hurdle. I hope to keep on working where I am presently and I take multiple courses every year to improve my knowledge and skill set and keep close tabs on the industry.
May 26, 2016 at 9:06 am
You have to weigh out what you really want in a career and life, if it is just a paycheck and self preservation then take the job that pays decent fly under the radar, do not rock the boat, and accommodate your boss that may be extremely difficult to work and collaborate with. If you are really looking for growth and development it is often the lesser paying job that truly has a culture of developing its individuals to be leaders in the organization. I find the for profit sector to be the ones that are more likely to invest more in human capital rather than non for profit that focus on honing existing skills. Each situation is of course subjective but if you find a culture and leadership that are willing to help you develop it may be worth the pay cut and staying in that role then bouncing from organization to organization. I left a previous entity for a considerable increase in pay but found the subsequent organization and more so the leadership to be non accommodating and limiting, with someone relatively new in the career this was not acceptable for me and had to start looking for another role in the organization and eventually left said organization.
May 26, 2016 at 9:35 am
j_e_o (5/26/2016)
... I have revised my resume to remove half of my job experience and I removed all other dates (degrees and training) because I truly believe the problem was age discrimination (obviously I am older) and my mistake was to 'date' myself.
That is an excellent idea. I'm not quite 55 and I think I have definitely ran in to that problem.
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[font="Arial"]Knowledge is of two kinds. We know a subject ourselves or we know where we can find information upon it. --Samuel Johnson[/font]
May 27, 2016 at 8:04 am
For a long time I have disagreed with bosses and organisations in some jobs but then got on OK in other jobs. Things came to a head 2 years ago and, at the age of 50 something, I got diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome. This is a psychological type that is common in IT but often misunderstood by all concerned. If you are interested, there is a self test at http://aspergerstest.net/aq-test/[/url]
I have just resigned from another job. This time it was because I worked out that there were specific parts of the job that were incompatible with me - I was getting on OK with my managers and colleagues but I didn't have the power to change the setup to suit me so I walked.
May 27, 2016 at 8:21 am
Recombinant (5/27/2016)
For a long time I have disagreed with bosses and organisations in some jobs but then got on OK in other jobs. Things came to a head 2 years ago and, at the age of 50 something, I got diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome. This is a psychological type that is common in IT but often misunderstood by all concerned. If you are interested, there is a self test at http://aspergerstest.net/aq-test/[/url]I have just resigned from another job. This time it was because I worked out that there were specific parts of the job that were incompatible with me - I was getting on OK with my managers and colleagues but I didn't have the power to change the setup to suit me so I walked.
Thank you for mentioning Asperger's and sharing the link. My son was diagnosed with Asperger's when he was a teenager. I believe it is important to know whether or not you're "on the spectrum" as we say, or not. It will help you better choose what you can or can't do.
Kindest Regards, Rod Connect with me on LinkedIn.
May 27, 2016 at 8:36 am
Rod at work (5/27/2016)
Recombinant (5/27/2016)
For a long time I have disagreed with bosses and organisations in some jobs but then got on OK in other jobs. Things came to a head 2 years ago and, at the age of 50 something, I got diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome. This is a psychological type that is common in IT but often misunderstood by all concerned. If you are interested, there is a self test at http://aspergerstest.net/aq-test/[/url]I have just resigned from another job. This time it was because I worked out that there were specific parts of the job that were incompatible with me - I was getting on OK with my managers and colleagues but I didn't have the power to change the setup to suit me so I walked.
Thank you for mentioning Asperger's and sharing the link. My son was diagnosed with Asperger's when he was a teenager. I believe it is important to know whether or not you're "on the spectrum" as we say, or not. It will help you better choose what you can or can't do.
People with Asperger's simply see the world from a different angle. Politicians and business leaders see the forest, which is important, but they too easily dismiss others who don't seem to see things the same way. People with Asperger's focus on the trees, but too is OK and also critically important. Consider what happened with the mortgage industry and tech startups in the early 2000s. In the years leading up to the collapse, there actually were folks pointing out the obvious flaws in the system but were ignored.
"Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of the wise. Instead, seek what they sought." - Matsuo Basho
May 27, 2016 at 8:47 am
NotaSQLperson (5/26/2016)
You have to weigh out what you really want in a career and life, if it is just a paycheck and self preservation then take the job that pays decent fly under the radar, do not rock the boat, and accommodate your boss that may be extremely difficult to work and collaborate with. If you are really looking for growth and development it is often the lesser paying job that truly has a culture of developing its individuals to be leaders in the organization. I find the for profit sector to be the ones that are more likely to invest more in human capital rather than non for profit that focus on honing existing skills. Each situation is of course subjective but if you find a culture and leadership that are willing to help you develop it may be worth the pay cut and staying in that role then bouncing from organization to organization. I left a previous entity for a considerable increase in pay but found the subsequent organization and more so the leadership to be non accommodating and limiting, with someone relatively new in the career this was not acceptable for me and had to start looking for another role in the organization and eventually left said organization.
You've said something here which I've never seen put quite like that. Non-profits are more interested in honing existing skills. Very interesting way to put it.
Kindest Regards, Rod Connect with me on LinkedIn.
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