QOD 15 Oct 2003
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In the past I've criticised the QOD for being too obscure, badly worded, or irrelevant. I think the response to all my previous moaning is this question!
The fact that more than 96% selected either the correct answer or the answer mentioning Convert surely means that this question is far, far to easy.
I think a new category of questions should be added, 'Noddy, imbecile and complete beginner' and each question should be weighted so as not to give too many points to such basic questions.
Maybe we could publish a blacklist of all the people that got this wrong to ensure they don't get jobs invloving any SQL Server access other than through a nice secure frontend app?
Tim
(Go on then, slate me if you must!)
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Whoa, never seen anyone put himself on everybody's blacklist so easily! Kicked a lot of asses, great!I guess it's always due to the QOD being too obscure, badly worded, or irrelevant, if your answer ever happens to be incorrect. Cool! SQL Server God is here!
Please start a born-with-full-scale-knowledge-of-SQL-server category for QODs... but somewhere else!
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Reminds me of an old Judas Priest song (if I remember right)
'Never satisfied'
Now, what I really wants to know is who are those 21 blessed individuals that have a perfect score on the 'Test Your SQL Server Security Skills and Compete with your Friends!' test ????
Frank
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Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
The poor sods that got the question wrong may deserve bonus points for honesty. You KNOW these people aren't peeking in BOL or the forum ahead of their response!
Edited by - renrob on 10/15/2003 07:31:16 AM
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Those who got the question wrong probably also haven't been peeking in Query Analyzer or working with SQL Server much either.
Actually it's good to vary the QOD & good to once in awhile have questions that nearly everyone answers right.
Data: Easy to spill, hard to clean up!
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These comments on QOD tend to imply that all users of SQL Server have a need for the same knowledge. A Developer writing stored procedures does not need the same knowledge about SQL Server as a DBA but I think both have a right to be involved in the SQL Server community and the QOD should reflect this.
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I think some people are missing the point with QOD. Even if you don't know the answer or get it wrong you then find out the right answer along with an explanation which makes it a great way to learn and improve your knowledge. Who cares if you're having to use BOL or Query Analyzer because you're that bothered about getting the answer right. It means you're still having to learn what the right answer is.
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I agree with Andy. I've learned quite a bit from the QOD and really don't feel ashamed when I get something wrong.
I feel that I learn especially from the questions that I get wrong simply because I am so anal retentive that I look up the reason. No, it is not to make sure the answer wasn't wrong...
Joe Johnson
NETDIO,LLC.
Joe Johnson
NETDIO,LLC. -
I might reiterate myself, but to me QOD is (educational) fun!
And IMHO the intention should not be to answer all questions straight out of the head.
Nobody knows everything in every situation. And nobody expects you to do so.
So another educational effect of QOD is to search 'smart'.
Almost every answer can be found in BOL when you know how to use it.
That's something that can be observed in forums, mailing lists or newsgroups all the time. People ask questions that could readily be answered by having one look at the tools they were given.
I'm not going to speculate on reasons why they do so.
Frank
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Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
Frank, Andy and Joe are right, it should be viewed as a learning curve. But I think this is going slightly off the original topic.
Surely if the question is so easy that everybody gets it right (incidentally I notice 90%+ correct answers on today's question too) it defeats the object?
If a question is so easy and people still get it wrong, they really shouldn't have anything to do with SQL Server at all. Most SQL Servers are running business critical apps and people with so little SQL knowledge as to get that QOD wrong shouldn't be allowed near those type of systems.
OK, it could be argued that maybe all users of this forum are not developers, and that perhaps people are simply interested from a personal point of view, but in the context of the other questions (with a few recent exceptions) these users would probably have been discouraged from answering the QOD a long while back.
With regard to the learning aspect, if you are a really basic beginner with SQL and needed to look up something like that then the same response above applies. Databases aren't like Word or Excel. You don't get a ready made environment where you can play about and learn as you go. You don't get the opportunity (in most cases) to simply undo or not save your screw ups. You can't come at a tool like SQL from a user mindset and therefore you must have learned, at the very least, the very basic concepts and database queries. As this QOD related to a very basic concept, getting it wrong by definition means that you do not have the skills to be using a SQL Sever app other than through a safe frontend.
Rant over!
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My 2 cents....
1. Anyone who provides a QOD that gets used receives points for it.
2. The SQLServerCentral staff is quite busy with this site and their 'real jobs' and therefore probably don't have a lot of time to keep coming up with QODs.
3. Have you suggested any QODs? Probably not and I haven't either, so it's not a slam/flame against you.
4. How are the SQLServerCentral crew supposed to provide excellent/quality/mind stretching QODs if we aren't helping them come up with any?
5. Not everyone is a guru. The name of the person who came up with the QOD is always listed. Maybe the person who came up with this 'easy for us' QOD is a beginner and this seemed to be a difficult one for them.
6. If a 'beginner/novice' came up with the QOD, I say 'way to go'. At least they provided a QOD for us to take. Even I haven't done that for this site.
Lastly, until I am willing to take the time to develop and submit 'worthy' QODs, I will not complain about a QOD someone else submits (unless the QOD is just plain wrong).
Off my soapbox now....
-SQLBill
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Just one more point.
I remember in the distance past when I had no stinking clue what a select statement was or even how to spell sequel. We all aren't born with intrinsic knowledge.
It takes time and effort to learn. I applaud anyone attempting to learn SQL Server and if they got the easy questions wrong, I hope they stick around until they are such snobs as we SQL oldtimers.
SQLBill, you are too right. I have not worked on questions for the site. However, I plan to rectify that over the weekend (along with doing my MBA classwork, Sarbanes-Oxley, running billing for my "work outside of work", and trying to spend some quality time with my family
).Or maybe I'll just not bitch about the QOD.
Joe Johnson
NETDIO,LLC.
Joe Johnson
NETDIO,LLC.
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