June 3, 2008 at 2:20 pm
Steve Jones - Editor (6/3/2008)
The being said, I have specialist friends I call when I know the problem is in their area. They do a much better and quicker job than I at finding a resolution.
Ultimately, I suppose the ideal is to have both specialists and generalists on the team: The specialists focus while the generalists navigate between areas. To use a military analogy, infantry vs. special ops. Both are neccessary separately and together.
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|Ted Pin >>
June 3, 2008 at 5:30 pm
In my previous company, my new manager was considered to be one of the hardest working person in the company. People said he always worked overtime. Actually what I found out his work was very sloppy. He got a project and finished it without thinking it through. So it ended up he always had to re-work a lot of his old stuffs.
But people did not know that. So the management thought he was a 'hardworking' employee rather than a 'sloppy' worker, he got promoted to become my manager. How ironic !!!!!
In another company, there was a big project going on. During the testing phase, the testers came to work on the weekends and the developers were on call if anything went wrong. After that my director gave reward to two of my co-workers to thank them being on call but I was not on the list. When my manager found out, he immediately gave me the award. He said he could not believe the director gave reward to the persons who never showed up on the weekends but did not give reward to the person who actually worked on the weekend (me).
Management !!!!! The director had a MBA degree. What did they teach in business school these days ??????
June 3, 2008 at 11:27 pm
Loner
MBA teach you how screw projects and people under you to go up the ladder...;)
June 4, 2008 at 10:05 am
They ask a few questions of the manager like, "So do you think the candidate will need ASP.NET experience?"
"Yes, of course."
"Would the candidate need to understand Windows security?"
"It would be helpful."
"So if an MCSE candidate applied, that would be ideal?"
"As long as he or she had the other skills, yes."
And then you get the ad that says ASP.NET, IIS, MCSE, etc., etc., etc.
Spot on! i often feel that is what a lot of recruiters do, cos so many times the list of skills they require are so far apart, it leaves one wondering if they have the slightest idea about what they actually need and it leaves you wondering if the organisation is a one stop shop for all sorts of technology and platforms.
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All it takes, is a step in the right direction, your feet will manage to find the way. I didn't say it'll be easy!!![font="Comic Sans MS"]:cool:[/font]
June 4, 2008 at 10:17 am
It's often laziness, people just start writing things and don't discriminate. If we could have a CCIE/MCSE/A+ with 12 years .NET and 5 years SQL Server 2005, that would be great. We could fill 3 slots, let's run that.
It's also that the hiring people don't necessarily know what is needed. I used to see ads in 2001 asking for 3-4 years .NET experience when .NET had been released for 1.
Don't be intimidated by the ads; they ask for too much. If you have some of the skills, apply.
June 4, 2008 at 10:29 am
What a great thread we have going here on this subject matter - but its funny (kind of) that this morning I ran into another example that impacts the topic...
For six months we have been working on a small app and we got it nailed down a few days ago. We release this afternoon. So what happened this morning? C'mon guys, you can probably guess...
After six months of not paying attention to our work, the VP of Marketing suddenly decides we need changes. You know, big changes. So six months carefully building a sweet app with great code - and WHAMMO! Now in six hours we have to slap in his changes.
Where does sloppy code come from? It comes from caring, talented, quality developers who then get a visit from a Marketing guy who makes a few "simple suggestions". Yeah, a few simple suggestions like asking NASA for something simple like "Hey guys, just turn the shuttle upside down before you launch..."
Does anyone know a good Generalist OR Specialist who can make Marketing guys pay attention some time before the day of release? I suppose that would be like looking for a nice warm beach in the Artic!!!
June 4, 2008 at 11:27 am
Ted Pin (5/30/2008)
Loner (5/29/2008)
Companies keep saying they can't find the right person, do they know what they are looking for in the first place?That is a really good point. The shotgun approach makes me want to employ the counter strategy of applying even if I only match 40% of the requirements... but that breaks one of those "golden" rules of job hunting: don't waste HR's time if you don't meet the requirements. ....
I would certainly not make that a golden rule, especially if you are looking to move into something new. On my last job search, I would not apply for something I knew I was unqualified for, but I applied for several where I only came close to what they wanted and I got offers for some of them.
This is even more true when it is obvious that the combination of qualifications they are looking for is extremely rare, they will very often be more willing to consider whoever does apply if they see that very few of their applicants are perfect matches or when they hear the salary request for the one who is the perfect match.
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Timothy A Wiseman
SQL Blog: http://timothyawiseman.wordpress.com/
June 4, 2008 at 1:29 pm
You can't make the marketing or sales guys pay attention. Their job is to make money on what you do.
Your job is to let them know the impact of this. That "simple changes" might cause the whole thing or pieces of it to fail. Let someone else make the decision. Document your objections in email in case they want to blame you later.
June 4, 2008 at 2:03 pm
Steve Jones - Editor (6/4/2008)
Document your objections in email in case they want to blame you later.
I just want to echo what Steve said: CYA with an email trail that clearly states your objections. Obviously, you should go with whatever management tells you do, but those emails will usually ensure you don't end up with the blame when the mess hits the fan.
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June 4, 2008 at 2:37 pm
Most people apply for a job that they are not qualified for because they do not have a job and they desperately need a job or some people just hate their current job so much, they apply every job they think they can do.
Sometimes you cannot blame them, I did the same thing before when I lost my job.
June 4, 2008 at 7:06 pm
Loner (6/4/2008)
Most people apply for a job that they are not qualified for because they do not have a job and they desperately need a job or some people just hate their current job so much, they apply every job they think they can do.Sometimes you cannot blame them, I did the same thing before when I lost my job.
And some folks do it because they want to grow, even if they like their current job. There are a whole host of reasons. But when you look at some of the job announcements out there, as Steve indicated, there's no way anyone can meet them. The 3 years of .NET experience when it's only been out is a classic example. I remember a job that was advertised in 2005 which wanted 5 years of SQL Server 2005 experience. I hope they meant 5 years of experience with SQL Server including some with SQL Server 2005, but I never did find out.
K. Brian Kelley
@kbriankelley
June 4, 2008 at 11:49 pm
I agree with you Brian. Most of the recruiters are non-it background. They most of the cases screw up the things. In Feb '08 I recieved a call asking for 3 yrs exp in Windows Server 2008 environment. I told them be clear what you want or tell your technical guy to talk to me.
🙂
June 5, 2008 at 12:04 am
hahaha..
nice one..
recruiters know nothing but to hire..;p BTW, i'm an Electronics and Communication Engineer Graduate..
hmmm.. i wonder why im on database..?!? haha
June 5, 2008 at 5:51 am
paksyeet (6/5/2008)
recruiters know nothing but to hire..;p BTW, i'm an Electronics and Communication Engineer Graduate.. hmmm.. i wonder why im on database..?!? haha
But that's a related degree, at least. If you want to see issues, look at the US military and officer selection. A friend of mine graduated from college with a degree in psychology. He was a comp sci major when he started. However, he flunked about every comp sci course he took and wisely decided to pursue another degree program. The USAF made him a... communications-computer systems officer. When he asked why, they told him he had the coursework to qualify. He told them, "Yeah, but I failed almost all of them!" The reply back was classic, "Yes, but you took those courses and therefore you qualify." I had another friend who had an electrical engineering degree at a time when the Air Force was critically undermanned in electrical engineers. Wouldn't you know it? They made him an aircraft maintenance officer.
Those were the days...
K. Brian Kelley
@kbriankelley
June 5, 2008 at 9:44 am
Hey I'm an economics major! I did have 2 years towards a masters in Computer engineering and my first two years of college were CS, but that doesn't appear on my resume.
A degree is a degree.
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