January 19, 2010 at 4:44 am
It seems to me that travelling to or from work in London is being made so intentionally hard its like and obstacle course. Now while I understand that snow and ice are natural occurrences, the knock-on effect to industry and infrastructure can largely be mitigated or avoided all together! It’s not like there wasn’t any advance notice or we don’t pay enough to the councils to sort this stuff out.
But thatis just weather. I have found that if it’s not the snow it’s the ice; if not the ice it’s the slush, if not the slush it’s the flood or rain. Then you have the occasional strike by the numerous unions who always want more money and time off for their members who (and lets be honest) don’t actually do much work anyway because of (see above). And if they aren’t striking, they are threatening to strike (which is basically the same thing).
And then on the odd occasion that the whether is ok, there are no stray leaves or bags on the track, the unions have had their unfair demands met and so there is no strike or planned strike; the train break down in the middle of the city, they cancel 3 major tube lines and your still f***ed!
So I thought I’d start this thread as a sounding board for all the Londoners who are just plain fed up with it. Maybe an official might see this and act on it (but I won’t hope for miracles).
Adam Zacks-------------------------------------------Be Nice, Or Leave
January 19, 2010 at 7:46 am
While I doubt it's intentional, they can claim "It's an act of God (Allah, Buddha, insert your favorite)" which seems to absolve them of responsibility if the cleanup doesn't occur quickly enough. We had a mayor back in the late 80's, in Chicago, who was NOT re-elected because he did not have crews react fast enough to a major snowstorm to soothe the masses. This led to our first, and so far only, female mayor. In nearly 30 years since, snow and ice have rarely, if ever, been an issue. Now as far as the unions...don't even get me started. I've seen 5-6 guys on a job. One working, the others standing around smoking, sipping coffee. Two-hours lunches, quitting time whenever the mood strikes Then they complain either that they are overworked or under-staffed. Huh, how's that work? Is anybody holding them accountable or maybe a few bucks being passed up the ladder to ignore the situation?? How do I get a job like that or persuade my boss to follow the city-sanctioned rules of the workplace? "Hey boss, going to lunch from eleven until two. And by the way, I'm leaving at three." That's going to go over well - can you say monster.com?
-- You can't be late until you show up.
January 20, 2010 at 2:04 am
Ok, so today a 07:13 train that generally operates a fast service to London, turned up 25 minutes late, it was a 4 carriage service (rather then the 8 carriage shown on the board and announced) and the proceeded to stop at all stations!
The driver (then obviously trying to make up time) was closing the doors at each step, so quickly that people couldn’t get off let alone get on. This is all one week after the management agreed to over inflated demands for pay, leave and job security.
SO this is the 'better' service we've been promised for months.....? :crazy:
Adam Zacks-------------------------------------------Be Nice, Or Leave
January 20, 2010 at 2:51 am
It's not just London. I have the same kind of problems trying to get into Manchester. When the snow hit the trains stopped. On the first morning of the snow, the automated boards said all my usual trains were on time, then one by one they just started disappearing, then re-appearing late. Finally a train arrived, over an hour late and 2 carriages instead of 4 and packed to overflowing. It then proceeded to stop at every station where other people who'd been waiting over an hour tried to force their way onto an already overcrowded train, causing frayed tempers (and more delays since they were blocking the automatic doors).
The following day I waited in the snow for an hour for the "on-time" train before giving up and going back home (which as a freelance DBA cost me a lot of money).
Once the snow has gone, the trains have returned to their usual 10-15 minuted late with no reasons (and don't try asking a member of staff coz you can never find one!)
The government is forever trying to get us to us public transport, but what chance do they have when the trains are overpriced, perpetually late, shoddy old rolling stock and so overcrowded they rival the Mumbai express. And don't even get me started on the buses!!!
January 20, 2010 at 3:26 am
Andeavour (1/20/2010)
It's not just London. I have the same kind of problems trying to get into Manchester. When the snow hit the trains stopped. On the first morning of the snow, the automated boards said all my usual trains were on time, then one by one they just started disappearing, then re-appearing late. Finally a train arrived, over an hour late and 2 carriages instead of 4 and packed to overflowing. It then proceeded to stop at every station where other people who'd been waiting over an hour tried to force their way onto an already overcrowded train, causing frayed tempers (and more delays since they were blocking the automatic doors).The following day I waited in the snow for an hour for the "on-time" train before giving up and going back home (which as a freelance DBA cost me a lot of money).
Once the snow has gone, the trains have returned to their usual 10-15 minuted late with no reasons (and don't try asking a member of staff coz you can never find one!)
The government is forever trying to get us to us public transport, but what chance do they have when the trains are overpriced, perpetually late, shoddy old rolling stock and so overcrowded they rival the Mumbai express. And don't even get me started on the buses!!!
Thats exactly the problem. We cant stop using cars cause the public transport system is not reliable (in the least). FCC which is the line i use is actually quite a good service (on the infinitesimal times that it actually does work). How can we rely on a system that doesnt work and costs more to use then the privately owned and maintained (your car) alternative.
But then the Government screw you again with the second road tax (sorry i mean congestion tax (i mean charge)), blah blah, you get the point. And then when it snows and the public transport service grinds to a hault and you break out the 4x4 (as thats the only thing that can tackle the untreated roads) and get you to where your going; the government charge you double tax!
When does it end :angry:
Adam Zacks-------------------------------------------Be Nice, Or Leave
January 21, 2010 at 5:49 am
I thought you may appreciate this. Its a question asked on the forum for the train line i use 'First Capital Connect'.
Please can you compare and contrast the following two scenarios:
Scenario 1:
You are at work. It is 1pm. You are hungry, blood sugars are low and you have an important meeting at 2pm. You must have lunch but have no sandwiches & no in house restaurant. You have no choice but to go out.
There is only one reasonable establishment close enough to your office to enable you to eat and return on time. It is shabby on the outside and looks busy inside. But has a decent enough menu - a bit pricey, but needs must. There is no takeaway option, but fast and efficient service is promised. The shepherds’ pie appeals – bland and simple, but will do the job. You go inside. It is 1.10pm.
A receptionist insists on taking your order and advance payment, before you enter the restaurant. Having taken your payment the receptionist informs you that there is no seating space and leads you to a crowded spot in a dirty corridor just outside the toilets. She tells you that, due to a shortage of available kitchen staff, your food will be delayed by approximately 30 minutes and apologises for any inconvenience caused. You wait. More customers are led into the crowded corridor. Verbal abuse and acts of physical violence ensue as they struggle for space.
Your food arrives after 35 minutes. It is an inedible mass of grey, gristly, maggot ridden, unidentifiable meat and potato that you would not ordinarily consider feeding to your dog. You cannot escape from the corridor, and are forced to eat it because if you do not you will surely pass out in your important meeting. You eat whist being jostled by your fellow customers, and then try to depart. You shove your way out of the corridor and towards the door. It is 1.58pm.
You reach the door. Your exit is barred by a large security guard who insists on seeing your receipt before you leave to prove that you have paid. You tell him that the conditions and food were disgusting, the service appalling and refuse to show him your receipt. He says ‘Well we fed you didn’t we?’. A further 3 security guards surround you, unzip their flies and begin to urinate on you. You find your receipt, show it to them. They open the door and you return to work. It is 2.15.
You are angry, wet, smelly, sweaty and covered in food. Your meeting goes badly. You bring sandwiches in future and never visit the restaurant again.
Does it sound far fetched? It probably does in the context of a restaurant. Now compare it to the following:
Scenario 2:
Passengers’ experience on the 08.06 First Capital Connect ‘service’ from St Albans to Farringdon on Wednesday 9th December 2009.
Train arrives at St Albans. It is dirty, but at least there is space to get on. You have already been unable to get on one train and there is no real option but to board this one to avoid being late and the risk of later services being full.
The train is overcrowded within 2 stops. People are dangerously crammed in, and more people are shoving to get on. There was physical violence and the driver was pleading with passengers not to break the doors, and asking them to push the doors shut.
You get off at Farringdon. There are random ticket inspectors present (despite assurances at the previous ‘Meet the Managers’ forum that this would not happen). One passenger suggested that they should not be required to show a ticket after the experience they had just been subjected. This resulted in that passenger being surrounded by 4 ticket inspectors, one of whom said ‘we got you here didn’t we, so you should expect to pay’. There was no physical urination – it was metaphorical.
This journey experience is typical of many in the last few months.
Is this so different to scenario 1? There are certain clear differences. Obviously the restaurant in scenario 1 would be out of business very quickly. In scenario 2 there is no real alternative for the customer, who may even have paid for a year in advance. FCC are allowed to continue to run the service in this way, and make money from it. I would, however, suggest that the customer experience in both scenarios is similar.
My questions are (a) are you brave enough to publish and respond to this question; (b) how can you sleep at night knowing you are treating your customers in this way; (c) why did you lie at the City Thameslink ‘meet the managers’ forum; (d) how are you allowed to get away with running your service in this appalling way; and (e) what compensation are your proposing?
Adam Zacks-------------------------------------------Be Nice, Or Leave
January 21, 2010 at 6:44 am
Is travelling in London made intentionally difficult? Not really. The Central and Victoria tube lines are generally very good, the Jubilee line can be a little temperamental, the others are hampered by obsolete rolling stock and signalling.
Outside London we rely on trains, and they're a different beast altogether. The rail franchisees inherit existing staff and Network Rail can't get rid of them either. They're the problem - they are openly contemptuous of passengers (and franchisee)to the point where they will deliberately find ways of obstructing a service, and any natural or otherwise genuine obstruction is obligatorily milked. And they're very difficult to get rid of.
Sorry Adam, but it's not a situation which is going to change overnight.
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
January 21, 2010 at 7:49 am
Dont we (users of the rail network) know it!
Stay safe, happy travels 😉
Adam Zacks-------------------------------------------Be Nice, Or Leave
January 21, 2010 at 7:59 am
Schadenfreude-Mei (1/21/2010)
I thought you may appreciate this. Its a question asked on the forum for the train line i use 'First Capital Connect'.She tells you that, due to a shortage of available kitchen staff, your food will be delayed by approximately 30 minutes and apologises for any inconvenience caused.
Wonderful! I hear "Northern Rail apologises for this late running, and any inconvenience caused" so often that even the computerised voice making the announcement sounds thoroughly pissed off...
If I could make my journey by car in less than 1.5 hours I would, but the roads into Manchester are crammed with people who can't stand using the trains. (One reason why we voted "No" to a congestion charge).
January 22, 2010 at 2:50 am
Surprised to hear about your problems with the trains in Manchester--my colleague, who gets the train in from Wigan to Manchester city centre every day, was one of the only people who made it into the office on the first big day of snow! Those of us with cars just couldn't get in.
Agreed about the service being overpriced, though. If I wanted to use public transport to get in I'd have a 2 mile walk to my nearest train station and then have to pay £7 return to get to a station which is still more than a mile from the office. It actually works out cheaper to use my car, despite that being a 26-mile round trip--and I don't have the 6 mile daily walk if I do it that way, either!
January 22, 2010 at 4:46 am
The 07:41 from Reading to Leamington was cancelled today for the second time this week. This is unusual, it's been an excellent service so far. The jouney home is in a different league, the train is rarely on time and is often 30 mins late.
Last tuesday, when we had that big lump of snow, I was also one of the few people who made it into the office. Folks only five or ten miles away were unable to get through the traffic / negotiate icy hills.
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
January 22, 2010 at 4:57 am
FCC have recenetly settled driver dispute, so the service was meant to be getting better (more trains with more carriages (4 vs 8)). Well the service on Monday wasnt bad (the scheduled trains were late but did turn up).
Since then its been truly ridiculous. Everyday the 7:13 from E&B is delayed by around 20 minutes, when it turns up its fall, the driver says that there is a train 2 minutes behind (that by the time you get to the next station has been cancelled!).
I ask you, whats the point in schedules? They mean nothing. If we as DBA's ran our systems with even 200% of the current public transport network efficiencey, we'd all be out of a job!
Adam Zacks-------------------------------------------Be Nice, Or Leave
January 22, 2010 at 5:01 am
paul.knibbs (1/22/2010)
Surprised to hear about your problems with the trains in Manchester--my colleague, who gets the train in from Wigan to Manchester city centre every day, was one of the only people who made it into the office on the first big day of snow! Those of us with cars just couldn't get in.
I know, that's my line in (through Daisy Hill, not Bolton). I made it on the first day of the snow (though an hour late). On the second day I waited on the station for over an hour before giving up and going home. I'd lost touch with my toes and figured if I didn't walk home then, I might not have made it at all.
January 22, 2010 at 6:26 am
Schadenfreude-Mei (1/22/2010)
the driver says that there is a train 2 minutes behind
Oh, I love that line! nobody believes it as it is rarely, if ever, true. Everybody pushes to get into the train until it's packed like sardines in a can. Either that or you run the risk of waiting 20 minutes for another full train (worse than the first) that was supposed to be 2 minutes behind. And that's if it comes at all.
-- You can't be late until you show up.
February 3, 2010 at 7:17 am
Chris Morris-439714 (1/22/2010)
The 07:41 from Reading to Leamington was cancelled today for the second time this week. This is unusual, it's been an excellent service so far. The jouney home is in a different league, the train is rarely on time and is often 30 mins late.Last tuesday, when we had that big lump of snow, I was also one of the few people who made it into the office. Folks only five or ten miles away were unable to get through the traffic / negotiate icy hills.
Been there done that. Several employers ago, commute was 90 miles one-way, several times during the winter my boss asked what I was doing at work during heavy snow storms between Colorado Springs and Denver. I made it in, but people in the Denver area were calling in that they couldn't.
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