March 7, 2019 at 8:16 am
patrickmcginnis59 10839 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:01 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:54 AMYeah, it's fairly routine to create the ado.net code, but also tedious and error prone. You can write that code all day long for free, or you can click a button and have it written for you. If you do that once a month, the product has more than payed for itself, and you haven't even touched things like transient error handling, field validation, or the POCO's that you have to create.I think its a bit pricey considering what it does, but the limit on executions is a dealbreaker. Best of luck in any case!
You tell me what you want to pay for a completely unrestricted account and I will make it happen.
And if that does not satisfy you, I can't help you.
Alan Hyneman
March 7, 2019 at 8:19 am
roby 44391 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:14 AMHate to break it to you but ado.net code generators are not new (T4 templates anyone?) and unfortunately there's nothing innovative about this.
e.g. https://github.com/aeslinger0/sqlsharpener
Semantic tags in your SQL are completely new sir. Please read the full article, and give it fair review.
Alan Hyneman
March 7, 2019 at 8:25 am
ALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:16 AMpatrickmcginnis59 10839 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:01 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:54 AMYeah, it's fairly routine to create the ado.net code, but also tedious and error prone. You can write that code all day long for free, or you can click a button and have it written for you. If you do that once a month, the product has more than payed for itself, and you haven't even touched things like transient error handling, field validation, or the POCO's that you have to create.I think its a bit pricey considering what it does, but the limit on executions is a dealbreaker. Best of luck in any case!
You tell me what you want to pay for a completely unrestricted account and I will make it happen.
And if that does not satisfy you, I can't help you.
You come off sounding like one of the Shark Tank contestants that's way too defensive and aggressive when getting constructive criticism. It's a new product and there is always room for improvement. Makes me wonder what kind of support I would get if I had issues. With that in mind, "I'm out".
March 7, 2019 at 8:36 am
tcsmith 21039 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:25 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:16 AMpatrickmcginnis59 10839 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:01 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:54 AMYeah, it's fairly routine to create the ado.net code, but also tedious and error prone. You can write that code all day long for free, or you can click a button and have it written for you. If you do that once a month, the product has more than payed for itself, and you haven't even touched things like transient error handling, field validation, or the POCO's that you have to create.I think its a bit pricey considering what it does, but the limit on executions is a dealbreaker. Best of luck in any case!
You tell me what you want to pay for a completely unrestricted account and I will make it happen.
And if that does not satisfy you, I can't help you.You come off sounding like one of the Shark Tank contestants that's way too defensive and aggressive when getting constructive criticism. It's a new product and there is always room for improvement. Makes me wonder what kind of support I would get if I had issues. With that in mind, "I'm out".
I offered to give it to you, I don't see that as being aggressive, I though it was rather nice of me.
Alan Hyneman
March 7, 2019 at 8:49 am
ALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 5:43 AMTim Johnstone - Thursday, March 7, 2019 3:36 AMThe website for this product indicates you can "try" for free. Presumably then there's a cost, but no published pricing or explanation of what features are cost. I'm interested, but I'm not investing time looking in to it without knowing what it'll ultimately cost or when the cost will kick in. Can you elaborate?Pricing is tiered as follows:
Free 0.00 Includes 2,000 file generations first month, 100 thereafter.
Individual 19.95 Includes 2,000 file generations per month. Does not support teams.
Small Team 49.95 Includes 5,000 file generations per month. Supports teams up to 5 users.
Enterprise 99.95 Includes 10,000 file generations per month. Supports teams up to 100 users.It would be real nice to give this away, but it has to be self sustaining.
Are these prices one time, or per month, or per year?
Student of SQL and Golf, Master of Neither
March 7, 2019 at 8:57 am
ALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:19 AMroby 44391 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:14 AMHate to break it to you but ado.net code generators are not new (T4 templates anyone?) and unfortunately there's nothing innovative about this.
e.g. https://github.com/aeslinger0/sqlsharpenerSemantic tags in your SQL are completely new sir. Please read the full article, and give it fair review.
:doze: back to the drawing board if you want to claim "the first real innovation in data access for quite some time"
March 7, 2019 at 9:09 am
ALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:16 AMpatrickmcginnis59 10839 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:01 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:54 AMYeah, it's fairly routine to create the ado.net code, but also tedious and error prone. You can write that code all day long for free, or you can click a button and have it written for you. If you do that once a month, the product has more than payed for itself, and you haven't even touched things like transient error handling, field validation, or the POCO's that you have to create.I think its a bit pricey considering what it does, but the limit on executions is a dealbreaker. Best of luck in any case!
You tell me what you want to pay for a completely unrestricted account and I will make it happen.
And if that does not satisfy you, I can't help you.
kiwood brought up a good point, products like yours would really help on bigger projects, but based on the estimates posted by kiwood, we'd run up against the limit for a single build. Pricing is always iffy, you have to balance the costs of development and support against the selling price.
No worries, we're just chatting about your product, I hope you're successful in any case, I'm a big fan of programming for money!
March 7, 2019 at 9:16 am
roby 44391 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:57 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:19 AMroby 44391 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:14 AMHate to break it to you but ado.net code generators are not new (T4 templates anyone?) and unfortunately there's nothing innovative about this.
e.g. https://github.com/aeslinger0/sqlsharpenerSemantic tags in your SQL are completely new sir. Please read the full article, and give it fair review.
:doze: back to the drawing board if you want to claim "the first real innovation in data access for quite some time"
I find it interesting that you joined 2 hours ago, seemingly to point people to an alternative.
Adding tags to your SQL is new, I know this cause I came with the idea myself, and have the patent for it.
Clearly you didn't read the article since there is a considerable difference between simply using a T4 template, and creating a language extension in addition to code generation so that validation of parameters is consolidated to a single point.
Also, since code generation happens in the cloud, those templates are easily updated and changes propagate out immediately, swapping a template simply means changing your configuration.
Alan Hyneman
March 7, 2019 at 9:18 am
In my current shop, we rely heavily on dynamic SQL. How does this tool deal with that?
Gerald Britton, Pluralsight courses
March 7, 2019 at 9:23 am
patrickmcginnis59 10839 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 9:09 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:16 AMpatrickmcginnis59 10839 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:01 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:54 AMYeah, it's fairly routine to create the ado.net code, but also tedious and error prone. You can write that code all day long for free, or you can click a button and have it written for you. If you do that once a month, the product has more than payed for itself, and you haven't even touched things like transient error handling, field validation, or the POCO's that you have to create.I think its a bit pricey considering what it does, but the limit on executions is a dealbreaker. Best of luck in any case!
You tell me what you want to pay for a completely unrestricted account and I will make it happen.
And if that does not satisfy you, I can't help you.kiwood brought up a good point, products like yours would really help on bigger projects, but based on the estimates posted by kiwood, we'd run up against the limit for a single build. Pricing is always iffy, you have to balance the costs of development and support against the selling price.
No worries, we're just chatting about your product, I hope you're successful in any case, I'm a big fan of programming for money!
Those are not limits, those are the number of files you get for the monthly fee, you have unlimited renders, and once rendered, you don't need to render it again unless you change it.
So if you are changing 600 tables and 4 procs for each table daily, you be at 2400 procs a day. More realistically is that you would build once, tweak one or two and build again, and choose to build only the ones you've changed.
Like I said, whatever you want I will make it happen.
Alan Hyneman
March 7, 2019 at 9:30 am
g.britton - Thursday, March 7, 2019 9:18 AMIn my current shop, we rely heavily on dynamic SQL. How does this tool deal with that?
This is a tool that is geared towards people who prefer writing stored procedures and is probably not the best option for you current approach.
There are plenty of alternatives to dynamic sql, and plenty of good articles on sql server central, but again, this is a different kind of tool.
Alan Hyneman
March 7, 2019 at 10:38 am
ALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 9:16 AMroby 44391 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:57 AMALAN.H.HYNEMAN - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:19 AMroby 44391 - Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:14 AMHate to break it to you but ado.net code generators are not new (T4 templates anyone?) and unfortunately there's nothing innovative about this.
e.g. https://github.com/aeslinger0/sqlsharpenerSemantic tags in your SQL are completely new sir. Please read the full article, and give it fair review.
:doze: back to the drawing board if you want to claim "the first real innovation in data access for quite some time"I find it interesting that you joined 2 hours ago, seemingly to point people to an alternative.
Adding tags to your SQL is new, I know this cause I came with the idea myself, and have the patent for it.
Clearly you didn't read the article since there is a considerable difference between simply using a T4 template, and creating a language extension in addition to code generation so that validation of parameters is consolidated to a single point.
Also, since code generation happens in the cloud, those templates are easily updated and changes propagate out immediately, swapping a template simply means changing your configuration.
Just talking about the patentability of this (and no I'm not doubting your patent application was accepted), how does this compare with the c macro processor which also takes statements that look like comments? Would you consider that prior art? Did you include prior art? I'm interested because I wouldn't have considered that patent worthy. I have already used directives in comments in my own little trivial language.
March 7, 2019 at 1:37 pm
Alan,
Wow, what a hostile audience. Maybe you should have addressed this to a .NET developer environment. I am strictly a SQL Server developer. I work primarily in an ETL shop so me maintain many SSIS packages that import/export data. Most data retrieval is done via stored procedures so this product, unfortunately, would not be of much benefit to me. Other than developing SSIS packages, I haven't worked with Visual Studio as a .NET development environment since around 2012. But I can tell you, having the knowledge I do of SQL Server and if I went back to an application developer role, I think I'd be all over this product. I remember setting up parameters and getters/setters and calls and how much I hate Entity Framework (primarily because I came out of a shop that actually used it to generate the tables used by the objects, and it was SLOW!
Best of luck to you.
March 7, 2019 at 2:09 pm
doug.bishop - Thursday, March 7, 2019 1:37 PMAlan,
Wow, what a hostile audience. Maybe you should have addressed this to a .NET developer environment. I am strictly a SQL Server developer. I work primarily in an ETL shop so me maintain many SSIS packages that import/export data. Most data retrieval is done via stored procedures so this product, unfortunately, would not be of much benefit to me. Other than developing SSIS packages, I haven't worked with Visual Studio as a .NET development environment since around 2012. But I can tell you, having the knowledge I do of SQL Server and if I went back to an application developer role, I think I'd be all over this product. I remember setting up parameters and getters/setters and calls and how much I hate Entity Framework (primarily because I came out of a shop that actually used it to generate the tables used by the objects, and it was SLOW!
Best of luck to you.
Yeah he got chewed up pretty good LOL but I think that's the nature of marketing to techies, sometimes we're a naturally skeptical bunch. Maybe he'll get some better responses from others here that might make up for his initial difficulties 🙂
March 7, 2019 at 2:21 pm
Thank You Doug,
But it's been very well received, had a lot of signups, many conversations with other developers, features requests, and other suggestions, I appreciate all the feedback.
Some takeaways for me
Adding a price page so pricing is transparent and up front...
We now have our own tag at stack overflow sql-plus-dot-net so dev questions can be answered in a community setting and shared.
The negative feedback, is less than 1% of people who viewed the article, I guess they are the 1 percenters.
Alan Hyneman
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