August 11, 2011 at 1:16 pm
I'm about to say forget it, I've taken the test twice and I'm about to take the 70-448 a third time and it isn't working out. I want to get some experience so that I can pass the exam. A low entry level job will do. And I'm fine with making 25k a year. I just seriously want some experience. Do I need a cert for a low entry level job? And if I do not require a cert, what's the best way I can get an entry level job doing some basic hands on things with SQL so that I can eventually pass this exam? I heard the 70-448 was actually a poor rendition of the real SQL work world. If so could I get enough complaints into Microsoft so that they can change their next SQL exam?
As always thanks, SQL Kidd
Update:
Sorry guys I meant without a Cert.
August 11, 2011 at 1:57 pm
If you have no experience at all, a cert's not necessarily going to help you.
http://www.brentozar.com/archive/2009/04/how-to-get-a-junior-dba-job-part-1/
That said, 448 is a BI exam, so what kind of jobs are you looking for? A junior dev job might be relatively easy to get, but BI is one of those things that requires experience in a fair few areas.
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability
August 12, 2011 at 8:13 am
I don't have any certs and I've been a database analyst working with SQL Server for the last three years. I would recommend finding some books or online tutorials that introduce you to the basic concepts of SQL Server, work with the AdventureWorks database and practice writing stored procedures. That's how I started out and I hope to end up being my company's DBA. What I learned is you have to be patient, you won't know everything but there are plenty of people on this forum that are willing to help as well as endless materials on the Internet. Don't worry about getting certified right away, like I said I've been at it for three years and I'm just now studying for the exams. Hope this helps.
Nate
N. Heard
August 12, 2011 at 11:07 am
hello
August 12, 2011 at 11:23 am
SQL Kidd (8/12/2011)
I just want an extremely basic job that I can get some hands on experience in. I don't care if it's the most rudimentary job, as long as I gain some knowledge and learn key skills. I don't even care if it's in another area of SQL, such as development or Implementation and maintenance. All I care about is getting some real hands on experience that allows me to kill two birds with one stone i.e. gain knowledge while also gaining experience. My only standard is that the job pays me at least 25'000$ a year so that I can help my family around the house. An additional bonus would be a good work environment that is tolerant and teaches me the basics. I am not afraid to do some research and work my butt off to make the job work. With all this being said, you have given me an excellent source of information.
Look for development positions. You're highly unlikely to get a BI position with no experience, it's an area that requires knowledge and experience with data, with business, with the office tools, etc. A junior dev position, maybe. Whether it's entirely SQL or front end language + SQL is another matter, latter is probably more likely.
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability
August 12, 2011 at 2:47 pm
As an independent individual, it will be impossible to put in enough complaints to Microsoft so they will change their exam.
As for getting a low paying entry job with a cert of two????? Well, that is not an easy question to answer because there is an oversupply of job seekers in your situation and the demand isn't really there if you don't have experience.
I will give you a tip in this job market though. It's more of WHO you know rather than WHAT you know. Your communication and people skill are more likely to help you get a job than a cert or two... I hope that helps.
August 12, 2011 at 3:51 pm
hello
August 12, 2011 at 4:01 pm
I actually felt this would be the answer. However, from the information I received- at the hands of my father that is- I "heard" (I know bad word) that SQL was actually in extremely high demand. It was in fact in so high of demand that companies were falling off their rear ends to find SQL people.
I'd like to get some facts about your claim based on your father's claims. If SQL is in extremely high demand, then I would want to start job searching for a better job that pays more if my skill and my cert would be so highly after. Can you name the name of some companies that are falling off their rear tend to find SQL people? Of course, there would be some, but you need to not forget the competition, and it won't a trifle competition.
August 12, 2011 at 4:16 pm
Some advice, check the web to see if there is a SQL Server User Group in your area. If so, start going to the meetings, network with the people there as they can help you find the contacts necessary to get that first entry level position, what ever it is. Also, the presentations you will see can help you to start understanding the scope of the SQL Server product.
Second, if you have a PC at home, get SQL Server and load it. Play with the system and learn it. If you have the money (about $50) by the developer edition as it will give you all the power of the Enterprise Edition for development and testing (or in your case, learning). If not, check out the different versions of the Express Edition that are available as those are free.
I hope this helps you some.
August 12, 2011 at 4:28 pm
I'm sorry, but pops needs to get off your back. And tell him it's just plain wrong to try to get your kid to compromise their integrity with a falsified resume!
SQL isn't just something you go read a book and Boom, You're Ready! People that don't understand data have little hope in mastering it so I hope you are good with data at least!
Definitely, Office certs will get your foot in a door Somewhere, and maybe you work up to being the DBA, but that 's a long shot and many companies don't care about Office certs. Teh question is, Do You Know Excel? y/n
I want to be brutally honest with you - if you have no passion for this line of work, it won't matter if you have the fattest paycheck in the world - you won't want to do the time, nor be on call, and it will be hard to get out of bed every morning.
I'm doing BI and LOVE IT!!!!! But, that's me, comign to the DW/BI world after 20 years in IT, most of it SQL/VB/.Net
Find your passion. If this isn't it, well, stand up to your dad. He cannot force you to do anything, and you shouldn't allow yourself to be forced into something you don't feel right about.
now if you are really into learning it, then see ifyou can "volunteer" to follow a SQL guy around - an unpaid internship. just a week or so to see if you have a knack for it. Non-profits would love to have volunteers, but may have no IT dept. Find people in your area and talk to them about getting in somewhere to do any job, but with the stated goal of learning SQL
Good Luck! Please keep us posted.
and my own personal opinion? certs don't mean crap. I haven't bothered for 15 years and have no problem getting jobs. what you know & who you know. not which hoops you can jump thru in MS's way.
August 12, 2011 at 6:44 pm
hello
August 12, 2011 at 7:01 pm
SQL Server User Groups, free. Something else to look for in or near your area, SQLSaturdays. Again, free training. I've been to two SQLSaturdays and they are great for both training and additional networking.
August 13, 2011 at 3:11 am
SQL Kidd (8/12/2011)
As for getting a low paying entry job with a cert of two????? Well, that is not an easy question to answer because there is an oversupply of job seekers in your situation and the demand isn't really there if you don't have experience.
I actually felt this would be the answer. However, from the information I received- at the hands of my father that is- I "heard" (I know bad word) that SQL was actually in extremely high demand. It was in fact in so high of demand that companies were falling off their rear ends to find SQL people.
Sure it's true.
Companies are falling over themselves trying to find competent, skilled, experienced SQL people. Good, competent SQL people are hard to find. Not complete beginners, there are always tonnes of those, and there are tonnes of SQL people who have a little bit of experience, don't really know what they're doing but have some idea and are always looking for jobs.
I totally get you and agree with you! Let me be even more brutally honest with you. I loathe technology! At best my heart can be described at its core as a naturalist. Now don't get me wrong, I like technology to an extent! I like being able to turn my computer on and look up my subscription to well... pleasurable websites.
Then please, for the sake of your sanity and that of your future co-workers, don't force yourself down a path you hate. If your love is law, study law and work in law. That's one of the biggest problems with IT, people who got in hearing that there's lots of money in it. There can be, but like almost all industries it's good money for those good at what they do who love what they do and who have been in the industry for some time.
It's not like the pre-2000 days when anyone straight from school with a cert earned way above average salary.
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability
August 13, 2011 at 9:53 am
hello
August 14, 2011 at 3:42 am
hello
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