DBAs and System Administrators
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I just read some of the backup/restore questions in Books Online that a DBA must ask, and encountered a speed bump at one of them:
Does your organization employ system or database administrators?
Could someone please clarify the difference. Would really appreciate it.
Karim
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system adminstrators are usually the windows adminsitrators. Database admins are for the SQL Server (or other database)
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system adminstrators are usually the windows adminsitrators. Database admins are for the SQL Server (or other database)
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system adminstrators are usually the windows adminsitrators. Database admins are for the SQL Server (or other database)
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As Steve says, SysAdmins handle the OS and network (sometimes there is a different Network Admin) and the Database admins handle SQL Server.
For example: I can assign someone a SQL Server login. But the system admin has to assign them a Windows account. I can set up a backup job, but it won't work if the System Admin doesn't give my account permission to write to the file. Sometimes the DBA backs up the database to disk and the system admin is responsible for backing up the backup to tape. I can tell a user how to connect to the database via Crystal Reports, I can even give them a SQL Server login. But the system admin has to set up the ODBC connection and open the firewall if needed.
-SQLBill
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System administrators manage the server the SQL Server runs on and, in smaller organizations, the workstations which the apps run on that connect to the database servers. DBAs manage the SQL Server itself.
K. Brian Kelley
@kbriankelley -
Some organizations also have Storage Admins who handle physical storage of data. So, as a DBA, you may have to interact with the Systems admin for OS/Windows related tasks and the Storage Admins for SAN/cluster issues.
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Hi, in our company two of us are Database Administrators and we have two System ( O/S, Network, Hardware ) administrators. As the lads above have clarified they are separate roles. Having said that, in our company from an on-call point of view we cover on call 1 week in four for both O/S and DBA. Cross training is suppose to happen but until then we rely on friendly calls between each other !!!
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As mentioned above, I also am a DBA in charge of backing up to disk, my SysAdmin handles the back up tape. However, that is where the distinctions end. I am essentially responsible for all my hardware and OS that SQL server runs on(Having a Systems Engineering background helps me for this) as well as 2nd or 3rd level application support(My company's motto is: If it is backended by a DB, I am the guy to see- I have had to learn IIS because of this.) I guess what I am trying to say is that it depends mostly on the size of the shop you are working in. I came from a large organization where duties were extremely narrowly defined; not so much where I am now. I even have active directory tools on my wokrstation.
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I'm a DBA in a small organization that also has a system admin. He's responsible for server hardware, operating systems, networks, and tape backups. The job responsibilities are pretty clear, but there is some overlap in function and we manage to cooperate pretty well.
I know enough about Windows admin to be dangerous, and he doesn't mind if I manage user membership in the Windows groups that my SQL security is based on, or fiddle with creating shares or managing permissions on servers to enable DTS or other ETL processes. He likes to be kept informed, but doesn't think I'm invading his territory. I have enough sense to ask him first about the security considerations of anything we haven't done before. He knows (or admits to knowing) little about SQL Server and consults with me about hardware configurations for the SQL Servers. If he needs some help with a SQL Server issue and can't find me, he usually finds someone else who knows the answer. I don't mind that, although I like to be informed about anything they fiddled with. (It's not that he doesn't know a great deal about SQL hardware configuration, but he doesn't want his list of responsibilities to grow any longer.)
This varies by organization and personality. Our previous sysadmin would go ballistic if any good-fer-nothin DBA set foot on his turf, and my hardware recommendations would often be ignored or reinterpreted. SQL Server was only an application that was allowed to run on "his" hardware. I respect his right to insist everyone keep their hands off any kind of network configuration or permission settings because he is responsible for network function and security, but I didn't quietly accept bad hardware decisions. There are gray areas of responsibility when you start adding storage hardware, or doing SQL backups to a file server. A sysadmin may want to specify and install storage hardware, but the DBA has to make sure he understands SQL Server performs best with a 64K cluster size. If I'm backing up databases to disk, and he's backing up that disk to tape, we'd better get together on what the backup schedules should be because it doesn't work well if you try to do both at once. The "it's all mine!"
However much we try to help each other out, I'm the one responsible for SQL Server issues and he's responsible for hardware, OS, networking, Active Directory, Exchange, etc. etc. If there's any difference of opinion, then it's decided by the person who will get blamed (the most) if it doesn't work.
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Hmmmm.... just to add my 2 cents.
Over the years I've worked in huge organisations and small organisations and the main thing that I can add to the above is that in my opinion DBA's are generally equally skilled as the sysadmins, they certainly need to have all of the same skills in order to do their jobs properly. The main difference being that whilst DBA's can and should be able to fill in for the sysadmin the same in not generally true in reverse.
Controversial? I don't care, and given that this is a SQL forum i'm sure most people out there will agree with me
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I agree with Scott Coleman in what was covered. I can performn Windows administration as well. So that means, job functions would overlap.
Our company is also small. We have two system administrators, not needed.
System Administrator: This person would build a server based upon DBA specifications (often System Administrators would not listen, they have their way of putting the server). They will research on fixing on the servers that they never put together properly. They will Google everything after all it is Microsoft. Funny....
Database Administrator: After the server is built, DBA would normally take over installing, configuring, performance tuning SQL Server.
System Administrators would normally intervene in a DBA job, as they cry for identity within the organization, reason being, DBA makes the SQL Server work even faster within server's capabilities. System Administrators have to constantly updating servers with windows patches/hotfixes/service packs, they feel proud/secure about their job, when they get blessing to apply/patch servers.
You see, windows platform sucks from the beginning. I guess, I covered pretty much.
Mahidhar Vattem
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Please note: 5 year old thread.
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverabilityWe walk in the dark places no others will enter
We stand on the bridge and no one may pass -
My bad.
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