April 26, 2010 at 7:24 am
DSD-464603 (4/26/2010)
Hi everyone,I am one of the member of hyderabadtechies.info....
Thanks for the comment, but I think you're taking the wrong approach here. All the good that you have done gets called into question if you don't react and remove the content, with apologies as soon as you can.
I do agree with you that it's not good to paint a large group with a single brush. I don't think that all Indians plagiarize, and don't agree with that comment. There are a lot of people from India that I call friends, and that work hard to publish information and pay others.
However plagiarism is a problem in India. A bigger problem than in the US, probably smaller than in other places. When you find plagiarism, you can't look the other way, can't condone it, can't make excuses. You have to call the individual out and you need to remove the content.
And you can't somehow post that you've done other things right. You need to apologize.
April 26, 2010 at 7:45 am
Hi Chandrashekar and others:
First of all, Chandrashekar, I appreciate your coming on this thread and how quickly you took down the posts. Plagiarism seems to be getting more and more common in our industry and not all site admins are honorable enough to react the way you have.
Regarding another of my comments: I just re-read my previous post and I don't believe that I implied that "all" or even "most" Indians are plagiarists, and I certainly don't feel that way. I work with a number of Indians on a regular basis and have great respect for them... not to mention the fact that I'm a curry fanatic 😀 -- so I absolutely have no intention to malign Indians.
That said, I do see a plagiarism pattern from that part of the world, and it's quite bothersome when so much of this kind of activity occurs from one part of the world. The only explanation I'd managed to come up with is that it is culturally more acceptable. But Roy and others have pointed out that that's not the case, so clearly my theory is flawed. Do you have any ideas on why this pattern seems to have emerged?
--
Adam Machanic
whoisactive
April 26, 2010 at 8:15 am
I think I know why this pattern is emerging.
1. They think they can get away with it. How many people would go to an Indian site to check some articles? Not many. Paul got it just because he searched for his own article. That was an unlucky break for the person who did this. Or else who would have known?
2. The population is so high and the number of Jobs are less. So some use this ugly method to get a name and thus get a Job/better Job/ Higher paid job. In the end it all boils down to money.
I commend the action taken by Chandrashekar. His comment was also good. He has a tough job in his hands, I agree. Like Steve said, if you need help, contact him and also try to see if it is Plagiarism. But I did not like the comment made by one of his team. You can never try to defend that situation you are in by putting that kind of comment.
I am an Indian. I love and respect my country and fellow Indians. But that does not mean I will defend anything done by an Indian if it is not right. I take offense that they are people who steal other peoples content for their personnel glory. That is pure thievery. I am sorry.
Sorry for this rant. It had me in knots the whole weekend.
-Roy
April 26, 2010 at 8:16 am
chandrashekarthota (4/26/2010)
As a site administrator I request you to kindly ignore my Core member comments. I amclosing down my site for few weeks just because of plagiarism and I have
learned lot of things esp: how serious issue is plagiarism. Its
totally my mistake for not directing my moderators in proper way.
Thanks to all the team because of you I have learned many things in
terms of the cautiousness I have to maintain and assuring you all that
this will never happen in future.
It's my humble request to stop the discussions about this issue as this site will however be down for few weeks.
I really appreciate Adam from whom I learned a lot and sincere apologies to original author.
I promise to see that such things will never happen in future.
Thanks for understanding.
-- Chandra Shekar Thota
Thank you - that is a good approach.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
April 26, 2010 at 8:24 am
Jeff Moden (4/26/2010)
chandrashekarthota (4/26/2010)
As a site administrator I request you to kindly ignore my Core member comments. I amclosing down my site for few weeks just because of plagiarism and I have
learned lot of things esp: how serious issue is plagiarism. Its
totally my mistake for not directing my moderators in proper way.
Thanks to all the team because of you I have learned many things in
terms of the cautiousness I have to maintain and assuring you all that
this will never happen in future.
It's my humble request to stop the discussions about this issue as this site will however be down for few weeks.
I really appreciate Adam from whom I learned a lot and sincere apologies to original author.
I promise to see that such things will never happen in future.
Thanks for understanding.
-- Chandra Shekar Thota
There's a lot of honor in those statements. Well said and well done, Chandra.
Chandra, as one of the authors whose article was plagarized on your web site, I just want to say a couple of things...
1. As I previously posted on this thread, I feel that you handled the situation absolutely 100% correctly. When notified of plagarized articles, you promptly removed them. And it didn't take days, or even weeks. You were on this immediately, and they were removed within hours. I believe that you removed my plagarized article in under an hour.
2. I do NOT have an issue with your web site having someone write something like: "Hey, found this really great article on xyz - go see it at http://www.sqlservercentral.com\...". IMO, this is the proper way to do it. It lets your web site viewers still have direct access.
3. The problem that I had was with the way the plagarized articles published on your web site as if it were in fact published by someone else for you. As the person that plagarized my article emailed to me:
i was just sharing some good articles that i had come across on the site.
But, it was being "shared" in a manner that implied that he had written the article. Not acceptable.
Chandra, again I thank you for your prompt actions. From what I saw of your web site before it went down, it looks like you are doing some very good things with it. Good luck in the future!
Wayne
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server 2008
Author - SQL Server T-SQL Recipes
April 26, 2010 at 8:25 am
I don't think it's cultural. I think it's more Roy's #2 reason. There are people looking to get ahead, and when it's a large number of people, there are a larger number of people willing to cut corners.
I think we have seen a large increase in plagiarism in US universities in the last decade for the same reasons.
April 26, 2010 at 8:30 am
Steve Jones - Editor (4/26/2010)
I think we have seen a large increase in plagiarism in US universities in the last decade for the same reasons.
I'm not sure that there is more plagiarism occurring. I agree that it is more evident that it is occurring. It is also a lot easier these days to find content to plagiarize and then publish it under the guise of being one's own work. It is a nature of the technology beast.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
April 26, 2010 at 8:31 am
Steve Jones - Editor (4/26/2010)
I think we have seen a large increase in plagiarism in US universities in the last decade for the same reasons.
This is certainly true. I have an uncle who teaches at a couple universities in the area and he was recently ranting about this. They have some software they use to check for infractions; I wonder if we can apply it in our field? Would certainly make life much easier for those who run sites as well as those who produce legitimate content...
--
Adam Machanic
whoisactive
April 26, 2010 at 8:33 am
We could. I'd actually like it if we had a good piece of software to help checks, and have someone independent, like PASS, host it. We could cut/paste a quick copy onto a site to check for issues.
The SQL community is fairly small, and I think we catch most people, but it would be nice to have a service that would be available. Allow people to submit content, check it for copies, and then store it as original if you don't find any. Need some way to handle disputes as well.
April 26, 2010 at 8:45 am
Steve Jones - Editor (4/26/2010)
We could. I'd actually like it if we had a good piece of software to help checks, and have someone independent, like PASS, host it. We could cut/paste a quick copy onto a site to check for issues.The SQL community is fairly small, and I think we catch most people, but it would be nice to have a service that would be available. Allow people to submit content, check it for copies, and then store it as original if you don't find any. Need some way to handle disputes as well.
This reminds me of the topic that we were discussing the other day.. Killing weeds. let us get some ideas.. 🙂
-Roy
April 26, 2010 at 8:51 am
On plagiarism, my alma mater has some free software:http://digg.com/u1UU6a. I could host something using this if someone wants to help code.
April 26, 2010 at 4:29 pm
On a slightly different tone - it is nice to see when people take the stuff you put out and use it.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
April 26, 2010 at 5:18 pm
Adam Machanic (4/26/2010)
That said, I do see a plagiarism pattern from that part of the world, and it's quite bothersome when so much of this kind of activity occurs from one part of the world. The only explanation I'd managed to come up with is that it is culturally more acceptable. But Roy and others have pointed out that that's not the case, so clearly my theory is flawed. Do you have any ideas on why this pattern seems to have emerged?
Hi Adam,
I think maybe you're overlooking a couple of things: (1) there are 4 times as many people in India as there are in the USA, so if the two places have the same attitude to plagiarism you should expect to see 4 times as much from India as from the USA; (2) the US incidence may be higher than you see: it's 8 years since the University of Virginia Faculty of Science released its plagiarism detection software, presumably they noticed that plagiarism had become a serious problem some time before that, and of course with such detection systems in use the incidence of publication of plagiarised pieces will be much lower than the incidence of attempts to publish; such software is not well publicised, so may not be deployed in India to the same extent that it's deployed in the USA.
I was a bit disturbed by your earlier post suggesting a cultural difference between India and the USA in attitudes to plagiarism, because I've spent a lot of time in India and i've worked with a lot of Indians in Europe and I have observed the reaction when plagiarism is detected - and a student at, for example, IIITM is in serious trouble if caught plagiarising. I won't make a comparison with equivalent US institutions, because I've defended US institutions when others have commented on the apparent weakness of their anti-plagiarism policies - I'm strictly neutral on the topic of which nationality is the worse offender in this respect (sometimes I even think it's the British, but then I look at various other countries, and end up changing my mind so often that I don't know what I think).
Tom
April 26, 2010 at 6:30 pm
Tom.Thomson (4/26/2010)
I think maybe you're overlooking a couple of things: (1) there are 4 times as many people in India as there are in the USA, so if the two places have the same attitude to plagiarism you should expect to see 4 times as much from India as from the USA;
Actually, we need to compare only SQL Server professionals, and we need to compare them to SQL Server professionals in all English-speaking countries. Those are the numbers I know, not the number of incidences in universities, etc.
So--are there 4 times as many SQL Server professionals in India as there are in the English-speaking countries? And what percentage of SQL Server professionals in India write blogs in English?
If the answer is yes and "the same percentage as SQL Server professionals in English-speaking countries", then we might expect 4x as much plagiarism from that region. Otherwise, it seems disproportionate.
--
Adam Machanic
whoisactive
April 26, 2010 at 9:24 pm
Adam Machanic (4/26/2010)
Tom.Thomson (4/26/2010)
I think maybe you're overlooking a couple of things: (1) there are 4 times as many people in India as there are in the USA, so if the two places have the same attitude to plagiarism you should expect to see 4 times as much from India as from the USA;Actually, we need to compare only SQL Server professionals, and we need to compare them to SQL Server professionals in all English-speaking countries. Those are the numbers I know, not the number of incidences in universities, etc.
So--are there 4 times as many SQL Server professionals in India as there are in the English-speaking countries? And what percentage of SQL Server professionals in India write blogs in English?
If the answer is yes and "the same percentage as SQL Server professionals in English-speaking countries", then we might expect 4x as much plagiarism from that region. Otherwise, it seems disproportionate.
Do you think it is actually SQL Server professionals who plagiarise? If so, I think you are mistaken - it's the would-be professionals who plagiarise. Are there 4 times as many would-be SQL Server professionals in India as in the USA? I imagine so. Are there 4 times as many SQL Server professionals in India as in the USA? I would guess there are, and maybe even more: in the USA a lot of the youngsters are into the fashionable thing - so object databases rather than SQL; in India I think the youngsters are more into things that actually work than things that are fashionable.
How many SQL Server Professionals in India write blogs in English? I can answer that one: just about all of them can read and write English, and use English if they blog about SQL Server.
Tom
Viewing 15 posts - 14,821 through 14,835 (of 66,712 total)
You must be logged in to reply to this topic. Login to reply