March 17, 2017 at 9:54 am
Jeff Moden - Friday, March 17, 2017 9:39 AMSean Lange - Friday, March 17, 2017 7:56 AMLuis Cazares - Thursday, March 16, 2017 3:16 PMSean Lange - Thursday, March 16, 2017 3:10 PMLynn Pettis - Thursday, March 16, 2017 2:59 PMI know what I write isn't always grammatically correct here in the forums, but in more formal settings, like blog posts, articles, reports, etc. I find even simple grammatical errors an issue. Does anyone else ever feel this way when reading these types of written communication?Yes. It drives me nuts when I read stuff in more formal settings that are poorly written.
I guess I shouldn't write any more articles. 😀
Seriously, it depends on the type of errors. I wouldn't be able to detect some grammar errors, but some are proof of poor attention to details. I've seen technical articles of so-called experts referring to Store Procedures.:crazy:Absolutely do not quit Luis!!! Your articles are great. And if you want a native English speaker as proof-reader I am available. And as Lynn said on this site I have a lot more flexibility because there are so many languages as native tongues around here. The ones that get me are the ones that use sloppy and lazy writing styles.
I also agree with Lynn that I am far critical of my own than others. This is probably why I have never published anything. I know that on forum posts that my typing doesn't always keep up with my brain and I skip typing words here and there which makes things harder to read.
+1000000 STRONLY second that notion. To hell with the grammar cops. If people understand what you're saying about the code or the method, then that's all that matters. I'll also say that you do a lot better than I do and that if people challenge you on such trivia, ask them to point you to an article they wrote that was aimed at helping people.
I don't call people out on the errors, I just find it distracts me in certain circumstances and makes it difficult to read the item in question as it seems like I start find more rather than concentrating on the topic itself. It usually takes a couple of readings to get through that when it happens. Again, it isn't something I do actively. I have noticed that it is more prevalent the earlier the error occurs in what I am reading, especially if it happens in the first sentence. Further into the topic, the less likely it will affect me.
March 17, 2017 at 10:07 am
Lynn Pettis - Friday, March 17, 2017 9:54 AMJeff Moden - Friday, March 17, 2017 9:39 AMSean Lange - Friday, March 17, 2017 7:56 AMLuis Cazares - Thursday, March 16, 2017 3:16 PMSean Lange - Thursday, March 16, 2017 3:10 PMLynn Pettis - Thursday, March 16, 2017 2:59 PMI know what I write isn't always grammatically correct here in the forums, but in more formal settings, like blog posts, articles, reports, etc. I find even simple grammatical errors an issue. Does anyone else ever feel this way when reading these types of written communication?Yes. It drives me nuts when I read stuff in more formal settings that are poorly written.
I guess I shouldn't write any more articles. 😀
Seriously, it depends on the type of errors. I wouldn't be able to detect some grammar errors, but some are proof of poor attention to details. I've seen technical articles of so-called experts referring to Store Procedures.:crazy:Absolutely do not quit Luis!!! Your articles are great. And if you want a native English speaker as proof-reader I am available. And as Lynn said on this site I have a lot more flexibility because there are so many languages as native tongues around here. The ones that get me are the ones that use sloppy and lazy writing styles.
I also agree with Lynn that I am far critical of my own than others. This is probably why I have never published anything. I know that on forum posts that my typing doesn't always keep up with my brain and I skip typing words here and there which makes things harder to read.
+1000000 STRONLY second that notion. To hell with the grammar cops. If people understand what you're saying about the code or the method, then that's all that matters. I'll also say that you do a lot better than I do and that if people challenge you on such trivia, ask them to point you to an article they wrote that was aimed at helping people.
I don't call people out on the errors, I just find it distracts me in certain circumstances and makes it difficult to read the item in question as it seems like I start find more rather than concentrating on the topic itself. It usually takes a couple of readings to get through that when it happens. Again, it isn't something I do actively. I have noticed that it is more prevalent the earlier the error occurs in what I am reading, especially if it happens in the first sentence. Further into the topic, the less likely it will affect me.
I'm not much bothered by misspellings and phat phingery particularly here on ssc, but can get quite cross when it's deliberate (e.g. "ur") and mixed with avoidable technical ambiguity.
It's, like, I don't friggin' care about my writtin, gimme a qurery or ur waistin ur time.
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
March 17, 2017 at 10:29 am
ChrisM@Work - Friday, March 17, 2017 10:07 AMLynn Pettis - Friday, March 17, 2017 9:54 AMJeff Moden - Friday, March 17, 2017 9:39 AMSean Lange - Friday, March 17, 2017 7:56 AMLuis Cazares - Thursday, March 16, 2017 3:16 PMSean Lange - Thursday, March 16, 2017 3:10 PMLynn Pettis - Thursday, March 16, 2017 2:59 PMI know what I write isn't always grammatically correct here in the forums, but in more formal settings, like blog posts, articles, reports, etc. I find even simple grammatical errors an issue. Does anyone else ever feel this way when reading these types of written communication?Yes. It drives me nuts when I read stuff in more formal settings that are poorly written.
I guess I shouldn't write any more articles. 😀
Seriously, it depends on the type of errors. I wouldn't be able to detect some grammar errors, but some are proof of poor attention to details. I've seen technical articles of so-called experts referring to Store Procedures.:crazy:Absolutely do not quit Luis!!! Your articles are great. And if you want a native English speaker as proof-reader I am available. And as Lynn said on this site I have a lot more flexibility because there are so many languages as native tongues around here. The ones that get me are the ones that use sloppy and lazy writing styles.
I also agree with Lynn that I am far critical of my own than others. This is probably why I have never published anything. I know that on forum posts that my typing doesn't always keep up with my brain and I skip typing words here and there which makes things harder to read.
+1000000 STRONLY second that notion. To hell with the grammar cops. If people understand what you're saying about the code or the method, then that's all that matters. I'll also say that you do a lot better than I do and that if people challenge you on such trivia, ask them to point you to an article they wrote that was aimed at helping people.
I don't call people out on the errors, I just find it distracts me in certain circumstances and makes it difficult to read the item in question as it seems like I start find more rather than concentrating on the topic itself. It usually takes a couple of readings to get through that when it happens. Again, it isn't something I do actively. I have noticed that it is more prevalent the earlier the error occurs in what I am reading, especially if it happens in the first sentence. Further into the topic, the less likely it will affect me.
I'm not much bothered by misspellings and phat phingery particularly here on ssc, but can get quite cross when it's deliberate (e.g. "ur") and mixed with avoidable technical ambiguity.
It's, like, I don't friggin' care about my writtin, gimme a qurery or ur waistin ur time.
I just think that if you are taking the time to write a technical article, that some time should be spent validating your grammar. Obvious errors, especially in the first couple of sentences, can affect how someone else perceives the content. When I am proof reading, yes, I really look for them, but even I can miss some as my mind puts in the correct wording at times. I have found this to be true when I have helped my daughter when proofing some of her papers for college. I don't find many, and I know some errors for all of us come from fast minds and slow fingers. We think the words but they don't always make it into our writing, but we see them while reading what we wrote. We usually find the omission after hitting post or sending it to someone else, or when we come back to it a day or two later and say what the heck?
People using text-speak bother me even in texts. Even there I tend to write everything out.
March 17, 2017 at 10:43 am
Lynn Pettis - Friday, March 17, 2017 10:29 AMPeople using text-speak bother me even in texts. Even there I tend to write everything out.
It annoys me now. 15 years ago, when everyone used Pay As you Go, and got 10 texts a quid, or they were limited to 100 texts a month on your contract, not so much.
"Back" then, you made sure that you squeezed your texts so that fit into the smallest amount of texts as possible. If that meant changing "wait", to "w8", or every "you" you "u", you did it. Now, when every phone contract has unlimited texts, and texts literally cost a few pennies at most. Do you really need to ensure you squeeze that 175 characters down to 160, and burn your copy of the Oxford English dictionary at the same time? Probably not. 😉
When I see in in forum post though (and I'm not talking about just here), which is written along the lines of: "Hi evry1. Cn u tell me ow I do SQL dat do DELETE n give rslts bck?", I do wonder about the person posting it. It also makes my eyes feel like they want to bleed. :crying:
:hehe:
Thom~
Excuse my typos and sometimes awful grammar. My fingers work faster than my brain does.
Larnu.uk
March 17, 2017 at 10:59 am
Thom A - Friday, March 17, 2017 10:43 AMLynn Pettis - Friday, March 17, 2017 10:29 AMPeople using text-speak bother me even in texts. Even there I tend to write everything out.It annoys me now. 15 years ago, when everyone used Pay As you Go, and got 10 texts a quid, or they were limited to 100 texts a month on your contract, not so much.
"Back" then, you made sure that you squeezed your texts so that fit into the smallest amount of texts as possible. If that meant changing "wait", to "w8", or every "you" you "u", you did it. Now, when every phone contract has unlimited texts, and texts literally cost a few pennies at most. Do you really need to ensure you squeeze that 175 characters down to 160, and burn your copy of the Oxford English dictionary at the same time? Probably not. 😉
When I see in in forum post though (and I'm not talking about just here), which is written along the lines of: "Hi evry1. Cn u tell me ow I do SQL dat do DELETE n give rslts bck?", I do wonder about the person posting it. It also makes my eyes feel like they want to bleed. :crying:
:hehe:
I hate to admit it but when I see posts like that I always just assume they are about 25 and don't know any better because they never had to write anything correctly. I see this kind of stuff making it ways more and more into the work place which drives me crazy. I never really thought I would be a grumpy old man but here I am killing it. 🙂
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March 17, 2017 at 11:13 am
I tend to be more interested in ideas and correct code than perfect English.
Some concepts can be hard to describe.
And this can be more difficult when writing vs. speaking.
I admire those who are fairly fluent in more than 1 language.
Soda, Coke, Cola has some different meanings depending on where you are.
So to someone like Luis or Sean, write away.
I can learn far more asking for clarification on a topic than criticizing grammar.
Which I am sure either of you would be more than happy to supply that if I asked.
Writing and speaking are both skills we get better at the more we do it.
And likely those that are critical have learned a lot from the imperfections of others.
So if they are 'perfect' themselves' they may owe something to those they criticize.
March 17, 2017 at 11:16 am
Greg Edwards-268690 - Friday, March 17, 2017 11:13 AMI tend to be more interested in ideas and correct code than perfect English.
Some concepts can be hard to describe.
And this can be more difficult when writing vs. speaking.I admire those who are fairly fluent in more than 1 language.
Soda, Coke, Cola has some different meanings depending on where you are.So to someone like Luis or Sean, write away.
I can learn far more asking for clarification on a topic than criticizing grammar.
Which I am sure either of you would be more than happy to supply that if I asked.Writing and speaking are both skills we get better at the more we do it.
And likely those that are critical have learned a lot from the imperfections of others.
So if they are 'perfect' themselves' they may owe something to those they criticize.
I agree. I guess I can just attribute it to getting older.
March 17, 2017 at 11:21 am
Greg Edwards-268690 - Friday, March 17, 2017 11:13 AMI tend to be more interested in ideas and correct code than perfect English.
Some concepts can be hard to describe.
And this can be more difficult when writing vs. speaking.I admire those who are fairly fluent in more than 1 language.
Soda, Coke, Cola has some different meanings depending on where you are.So to someone like Luis or Sean, write away.
I can learn far more asking for clarification on a topic than criticizing grammar.
Which I am sure either of you would be more than happy to supply that if I asked.Writing and speaking are both skills we get better at the more we do it.
And likely those that are critical have learned a lot from the imperfections of others.
So if they are 'perfect' themselves' they may owe something to those they criticize.
Here's Greg, who writes perfect 64-syllable Haiku every time - even when he's hanging onto a fish 🙂
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
March 17, 2017 at 11:24 am
If you're going to publish something in English and your English is dodgy, ask someone capable to proofread it for you first.
This way, everyone is happy, ambiguities and double-takes are avoided, and grumpy old men have fewer reasons to be grumpy.
The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence
- Martin Rees
The absence of consumable DDL, sample data and desired results is, however, evidence of the absence of my response
- Phil Parkin
March 17, 2017 at 11:36 am
Greg Edwards-268690 - Friday, March 17, 2017 11:13 AMI tend to be more interested in ideas and correct code than perfect English.
Some concepts can be hard to describe.
And this can be more difficult when writing vs. speaking.I admire those who are fairly fluent in more than 1 language.
Soda, Coke, Cola has some different meanings depending on where you are.So to someone like Luis or Sean, write away.
I can learn far more asking for clarification on a topic than criticizing grammar.
Which I am sure either of you would be more than happy to supply that if I asked.Writing and speaking are both skills we get better at the more we do it.
And likely those that are critical have learned a lot from the imperfections of others.
So if they are 'perfect' themselves' they may owe something to those they criticize.
Poetry. That's what I see with the pattern you're using here.
March 17, 2017 at 11:54 am
Phil Parkin - Friday, March 17, 2017 11:24 AMIf you're going to publish something in English and your English is dodgy, ask someone capable to proofread it for you first.
This way, everyone is happy, ambiguities and double-takes are avoided, and grumpy old men have fewer reasons to be grumpy.
I will never have fewer reasons to be grumpy.
March 17, 2017 at 11:59 am
Grumpy DBA - Friday, March 17, 2017 11:54 AMPhil Parkin - Friday, March 17, 2017 11:24 AMIf you're going to publish something in English and your English is dodgy, ask someone capable to proofread it for you first.
This way, everyone is happy, ambiguities and double-takes are avoided, and grumpy old men have fewer reasons to be grumpy.I will never have fewer reasons to be grumpy.
Me either. Just remember, getting older is better than the alternative. 😉
March 17, 2017 at 12:39 pm
I know it may be late in some locales, but is there anyone on that could help with some XML work? I am try to move from OPENXML to using nodes on a project I am working on, even though I have a valid OPENXML solution.
March 17, 2017 at 1:22 pm
Lynn Pettis - Friday, March 17, 2017 12:39 PMI know it may be late in some locales, but is there anyone on that could help with some XML work? I am try to move from OPENXML to using nodes on a project I am working on, even though I have a valid OPENXML solution.
I am up as it is 1:00 PM here. And I actually just had some fun doing the opposite. I moved from nodes to OPENXML due to performance reasons. But in my case, the nodes were pulling all of the XML, not parsing through small bits of it.
Not really an XML or node/OPENXML expert by any means, and the stuff I was working with was VERY simple XML:
<root>
<parameter>
<value></value>
<value></value>
<value></value>
<value></value>
<value></value>
</parameter>
</root>
type stuff. If yours is any more complex than that, I likely won't be very helpful.
The above is all just my opinion on what you should do.
As with all advice you find on a random internet forum - you shouldn't blindly follow it. Always test on a test server to see if there is negative side effects before making changes to live!
I recommend you NEVER run "random code" you found online on any system you care about UNLESS you understand and can verify the code OR you don't care if the code trashes your system.
March 17, 2017 at 1:33 pm
Lynn Pettis - Friday, March 17, 2017 12:39 PMI know it may be late in some locales, but is there anyone on that could help with some XML work? I am try to move from OPENXML to using nodes on a project I am working on, even though I have a valid OPENXML solution.
I may not change directions. The OPENXML solution on each individual piece is actually faster than the nodes version, plus I have it working with the xml that will be processed whereas I can't seem to get namespaces working with the nodes version.
Can anyone explain why it would be worth the effort to continue down the path of change?
Sorry, should have started a technical thread for this.
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