January 25, 2016 at 11:17 am
Luis Cazares (1/25/2016)
I've heard that legislation might be an issue for some industries.In Mexico, banks can't have their information outside of their physical locations.
We have contracts where we're mandated that we can't store data off-site. Several countries also have laws restricting where PII on their citizens can be stored.
January 25, 2016 at 11:43 am
Grant Fritchey (1/25/2016)
A few questions for the threadizens. Interested in this from everyone, but especially interested in what you guys who consult think.What blockers are you seeing for Azure?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse on azure?
Last place I was working, we already had a mature data warehouse.
We used SQL Server and SSAS - 160 GB (SQL) and 50 GB (SSAS), pulling daily from an AS 400.
We had some struggles with bandwidth just when they moved the warehouse to a new data center.
Rebuilding for Azure (besides the work) left a gap for SSAS.
Fixed costs for current vs. variable also a blocker.
Also size, as this was just our company. We were looking to scale out / combine other sites into a corporate DW, which likely would have been well over a TB.
January 25, 2016 at 12:01 pm
Greg Edwards-268690 (1/25/2016)
Grant Fritchey (1/25/2016)
A few questions for the threadizens. Interested in this from everyone, but especially interested in what you guys who consult think.What blockers are you seeing for Azure?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse on azure?
Last place I was working, we already had a mature data warehouse.
We used SQL Server and SSAS - 160 GB (SQL) and 50 GB (SSAS), pulling daily from an AS 400.
We had some struggles with bandwidth just when they moved the warehouse to a new data center.
Rebuilding for Azure (besides the work) left a gap for SSAS.
Fixed costs for current vs. variable also a blocker.
Also size, as this was just our company. We were looking to scale out / combine other sites into a corporate DW, which likely would have been well over a TB.
Cool. Thanks.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood"
- Theodore Roosevelt
Author of:
SQL Server Execution Plans
SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
January 25, 2016 at 2:33 pm
Ed Wagner (1/24/2016)
jonathan.crawford (1/23/2016)
Uh, how does one go Hand-To-Hand, exactly? Were you cramming pellets down someone's throat? I can also envision you sneaking around with a paintbrush and a pallette, drawing happy little Bob Ross trees on peoples' backs...Have you met Grant?
Is it just me, or all we now all hearing the typical Barney Stinson tone: "Here's a little game I like to play called have you met Grant. Haaave you met Grant?"
January 25, 2016 at 2:39 pm
Grant Fritchey (1/25/2016)
A few questions for the threadizens. Interested in this from everyone, but especially interested in what you guys who consult think.What blockers are you seeing for Azure?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse on azure?
My current contract is actually working towards the cloud (for their OLTP system, they don't have a datawarehouse). So they see no blockers.
I am worried about bandwidth. Their current bandwidth is cr*p, but they plan to upgrade that before actually going cloud. I really hope that the upgrade will be sufficient.
Another major blocker is the existing system. They have several third-party systems that use SQL Server for data, and then some home-built systems that try to tie everything together - by using a variety of techiques (so far I have seen linked servers for querying and updating directly in the 3rd party database, I have seen replication, I have seen Agent jobs that forcefully sync full table data every X hours (or minutes!), and I have seen various "message queue"-based systems that capture changes from triggers on the 3rd party databases and feed that into BizTalk for further processing by other systems. Getting all those undocumented cross-database and cross-server dependencies documented and replaced by things that Azure actually supports will be a huge challenge.
January 25, 2016 at 3:10 pm
Hugo Kornelis (1/25/2016)
Ed Wagner (1/24/2016)
jonathan.crawford (1/23/2016)
Uh, how does one go Hand-To-Hand, exactly? Were you cramming pellets down someone's throat? I can also envision you sneaking around with a paintbrush and a pallette, drawing happy little Bob Ross trees on peoples' backs...Have you met Grant?
Is it just me, or all we now all hearing the typical Barney Stinson tone: "Here's a little game I like to play called have you met Grant. Haaave you met Grant?"
Sorry, Hugo, but I have no clue as to the reference. I looked it to to find the TV show, but it didn't help because I've never seen it.
I guess I would have to say "Have you met Grant" to emphasize it the way I meant it.
January 25, 2016 at 3:20 pm
Ed Wagner (1/25/2016)
Hugo Kornelis (1/25/2016)
Ed Wagner (1/24/2016)
jonathan.crawford (1/23/2016)
Uh, how does one go Hand-To-Hand, exactly? Were you cramming pellets down someone's throat? I can also envision you sneaking around with a paintbrush and a pallette, drawing happy little Bob Ross trees on peoples' backs...Have you met Grant?
Is it just me, or all we now all hearing the typical Barney Stinson tone: "Here's a little game I like to play called have you met Grant. Haaave you met Grant?"
Sorry, Hugo, but I have no clue as to the reference. I looked it to to find the TV show, but it didn't help because I've never seen it.
I guess I would have to say "Have you met Grant" to emphasize it the way I meant it.
Here's a little help with Hugo's reference.
January 25, 2016 at 4:46 pm
Luis Cazares (1/25/2016)
Ed Wagner (1/25/2016)
Hugo Kornelis (1/25/2016)
Ed Wagner (1/24/2016)
jonathan.crawford (1/23/2016)
Uh, how does one go Hand-To-Hand, exactly? Were you cramming pellets down someone's throat? I can also envision you sneaking around with a paintbrush and a pallette, drawing happy little Bob Ross trees on peoples' backs...Have you met Grant?
Is it just me, or all we now all hearing the typical Barney Stinson tone: "Here's a little game I like to play called have you met Grant. Haaave you met Grant?"
Sorry, Hugo, but I have no clue as to the reference. I looked it to to find the TV show, but it didn't help because I've never seen it.
I guess I would have to say "Have you met Grant" to emphasize it the way I meant it.
Here's a little help with Hugo's reference.
Thanks, Luis. I never meant for it to sound that annoying.
January 25, 2016 at 4:56 pm
GilaMonster (1/25/2016)
Bandwidth, latency and data out of the country (for 1 and 3)
I see the same. Plus in the EU it's probably illegal to host the data outside the EU if any of it is personally identifiable - we now have a formal decision from the court that it is illegal to host such data on servers in the USA or servers outside teh USA but under the control of American companies. Of course some new "safe harbor" farce will be cooked up and be treatedd as real until the court once again deems it fake.
Tom
January 25, 2016 at 5:55 pm
Hugo Kornelis (1/25/2016)
Grant Fritchey (1/25/2016)
A few questions for the threadizens. Interested in this from everyone, but especially interested in what you guys who consult think.What blockers are you seeing for Azure?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse?
What blockers are you seeing for a datawarehouse on azure?
My current contract is actually working towards the cloud (for their OLTP system, they don't have a datawarehouse). So they see no blockers.
I am worried about bandwidth. Their current bandwidth is cr*p, but they plan to upgrade that before actually going cloud. I really hope that the upgrade will be sufficient.
Another major blocker is the existing system. They have several third-party systems that use SQL Server for data, and then some home-built systems that try to tie everything together - by using a variety of techiques (so far I have seen linked servers for querying and updating directly in the 3rd party database, I have seen replication, I have seen Agent jobs that forcefully sync full table data every X hours (or minutes!), and I have seen various "message queue"-based systems that capture changes from triggers on the 3rd party databases and feed that into BizTalk for further processing by other systems. Getting all those undocumented cross-database and cross-server dependencies documented and replaced by things that Azure actually supports will be a huge challenge.
That sounds more than a little challenging. So... if you could wish a tool into existence that helped you solve some of these problems for the migration, any idea what it might look like? I don't mean a magic tool, but some additional tooling not currently available that would make that process easier?
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood"
- Theodore Roosevelt
Author of:
SQL Server Execution Plans
SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
January 25, 2016 at 5:56 pm
TomThomson (1/25/2016)
GilaMonster (1/25/2016)
Bandwidth, latency and data out of the country (for 1 and 3)I see the same. Plus in the EU it's probably illegal to host the data outside the EU if any of it is personally identifiable - we now have a formal decision from the court that it is illegal to host such data on servers in the USA or servers outside teh USA but under the control of American companies. Of course some new "safe harbor" farce will be cooked up and be treatedd as real until the court once again deems it fake.
Yeah, they're passing new laws, plus safe harbor, plus the country-specific laws. Add in the Russian citizen data laws plus the US legislation and it's hard to sort it all out.
January 26, 2016 at 2:03 am
Ed Wagner (1/25/2016)
Several countries also have laws restricting where PII on their citizens can be stored.
We do, and that was the reason behind my 'data out of the country' comment. That said, our PII law allows for the info to be stored in another country iff that country's PII laws are equal or stricter than South Africa's. Hence storing the data in Europe would probably be fine, storing it in the US would not (at least last time I talked with someone who knew the relevant laws).
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability
January 26, 2016 at 3:34 am
Grant et al,
Not sure about the current places long term plans.
They are building an on prem Data Warehouse and looking to move it to 2016 as soon as (ish).
That's what Steph and I are here to do.
Cloud hasn't really been talked about yet...
But they are still looking for a senior DBA / team lead still to steady the ship...
Rodders...
January 26, 2016 at 3:44 am
In other news,
Just ran one of Jason scripts!
So everyone back away from their keyboards for a minute....
🙂
Nah, it worked as expected...
All good here!
Rodders...
January 26, 2016 at 5:35 am
TomThomson (1/25/2016)
GilaMonster (1/25/2016)
Bandwidth, latency and data out of the country (for 1 and 3)I see the same. Plus in the EU it's probably illegal to host the data outside the EU if any of it is personally identifiable - we now have a formal decision from the court that it is illegal to host such data on servers in the USA or servers outside teh USA but under the control of American companies. Of course some new "safe harbor" farce will be cooked up and be treatedd as real until the court once again deems it fake.
Where I come from, safe harbor means places where parents can drop off infants and babies without being arrested for negligence or child abandonment.
What does it mean in your statement, Tom?
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