July 25, 2014 at 2:47 pm
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
From what I am hearing by some people, a lot of Banks use BASE rather than ACID. In BASE, nolock would be ok because they write new rows 15 or 16 times or something like that.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
July 25, 2014 at 2:49 pm
patrickmcginnis59 10839 (7/25/2014)
Getting the account balance temporarily wrong isn't a big deal, that is what the end of day reconciliation is for. And an overdraft from an account is far more likely to occur because two ATMs are being used at once than because of a uncommitted read from a database.
He might have a point here, isn't that what folks talk about regarding partitioned mode? Granted, he doesn't take into consideration page splits but that was also mentioned in the thread, so folks are covering the topic at least.
I would completely disagree here. I have real world experience here that directly contradicts this. Getting the balance correct to the penny real-time is critical when it comes to plastic cards. I saw overdraft charges in the hundreds weekly because of littering a financial application with NOLOCK. In a system with lots of activity this is not a rare thing, it is real and it happens a lot more than many people think. You can't settle a card rejection at the end of the day when the person trying to make a purchase has just been denied. Talk about some pissed off people.
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July 25, 2014 at 2:51 pm
SQLRNNR (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
From what I am hearing by some people, a lot of Banks use BASE rather than ACID. In BASE, nolock would be ok because they write new rows 15 or 16 times or something like that.
I wonder how these systems deal with credit card transaction requests. Would be interesting to see how this gets used.
_______________________________________________________________
Need help? Help us help you.
Read the article at http://www.sqlservercentral.com/articles/Best+Practices/61537/ for best practices on asking questions.
Need to split a string? Try Jeff Modens splitter http://www.sqlservercentral.com/articles/Tally+Table/72993/.
Cross Tabs and Pivots, Part 1 – Converting Rows to Columns - http://www.sqlservercentral.com/articles/T-SQL/63681/
Cross Tabs and Pivots, Part 2 - Dynamic Cross Tabs - http://www.sqlservercentral.com/articles/Crosstab/65048/
Understanding and Using APPLY (Part 1) - http://www.sqlservercentral.com/articles/APPLY/69953/
Understanding and Using APPLY (Part 2) - http://www.sqlservercentral.com/articles/APPLY/69954/
July 25, 2014 at 3:02 pm
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
SQLRNNR (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
From what I am hearing by some people, a lot of Banks use BASE rather than ACID. In BASE, nolock would be ok because they write new rows 15 or 16 times or something like that.
I wonder how these systems deal with credit card transaction requests. Would be interesting to see how this gets used.
The numerous writes allows them to take the values from the majority of the writes and persist that. If the values are different a couple of times, that is ok because they toss out the "bad" rows. Different approach and I suppose it could work.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
July 25, 2014 at 3:32 pm
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
patrickmcginnis59 10839 (7/25/2014)
Getting the account balance temporarily wrong isn't a big deal, that is what the end of day reconciliation is for. And an overdraft from an account is far more likely to occur because two ATMs are being used at once than because of a uncommitted read from a database.
He might have a point here, isn't that what folks talk about regarding partitioned mode? Granted, he doesn't take into consideration page splits but that was also mentioned in the thread, so folks are covering the topic at least.
I would completely disagree here. I have real world experience here that directly contradicts this. Getting the balance correct to the penny real-time is critical when it comes to plastic cards. I saw overdraft charges in the hundreds weekly because of littering a financial application with NOLOCK. In a system with lots of activity this is not a rare thing, it is real and it happens a lot more than many people think. You can't settle a card rejection at the end of the day when the person trying to make a purchase has just been denied. Talk about some pissed off people.
His point is that getting balances correct to the penny is what reconciliations are for, and he has a point, because number one, reconciliations ARE going to get the funds, and number two, folks with plastic are legally obligated for their charges (as opposed to for instance that related bitcoin thread, folks are not tied to an anonymous account, and reconciliations don't do squat in that case).
I remember getting zapped by this, because I did two small transactions on my card, and then a third larger that overdrafted my account. The bank happily processed the third first and was able to hit me with 3 overdrafts despite applying the transactions out of chronological order (date/time) because they applied it ordered by amount descending, because its their business and I had legitimately overdrafted the account. So in my opinion, the guy is reporting reality.
July 25, 2014 at 6:20 pm
Heh... isn't "reconciliation" how they found out that some BitCoin bank had been seriously whacked because the current balance wasn't immediately calculated to the penny? 😉
I'm with those that insist there's no reason in the world in this day and age why balances shouldn't be instantaneously correct.
--Jeff Moden
Change is inevitable... Change for the better is not.
July 26, 2014 at 2:51 am
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Jeff Moden (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
Sorry for my ignorance... what is "SO"?
I thought that was Shockingly Obvious....
😎
Or Seriously Overrated.
Seriously.....doesn't even begin to grasp it. There are of course some very good contributors there but (excuse the pun) seriously, the level of noise and animal dropping like substance answers is far too high.
😎
No kidding. I figured I would setup an account and venture around a bit but wow. I never realized how shockingly bad most sql people are. My SSC shaded glasses have led me to believe that most people have a clue...wow!!!
I stay away from that site as far as I can (at least when it comes to answering questions...)
The problem is that sometimes I see shockingly bad answers, but I cannot downvote them as I don't have enough "reputation".
And the attitude of some people over there...
When I have .NET issues though, 90% of the time I find my solution on SO.
Need an answer? No, you need a question
My blog at https://sqlkover.com.
MCSE Business Intelligence - Microsoft Data Platform MVP
July 26, 2014 at 3:05 am
Koen Verbeeck (7/26/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Jeff Moden (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
Sorry for my ignorance... what is "SO"?
I thought that was Shockingly Obvious....
😎
Or Seriously Overrated.
Seriously.....doesn't even begin to grasp it. There are of course some very good contributors there but (excuse the pun) seriously, the level of noise and animal dropping like substance answers is far too high.
😎
No kidding. I figured I would setup an account and venture around a bit but wow. I never realized how shockingly bad most sql people are. My SSC shaded glasses have led me to believe that most people have a clue...wow!!!
I stay away from that site as far as I can (at least when it comes to answering questions...)
The problem is that sometimes I see shockingly bad answers, but I cannot downvote them as I don't have enough "reputation".
And the attitude of some people over there...
When I have .NET issues though, 90% of the time I find my solution on SO.
In other words SO's SQL isn't the brightest bulb araound:w00t:
😎
July 26, 2014 at 3:09 am
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/26/2014)
Koen Verbeeck (7/26/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Jeff Moden (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
Sorry for my ignorance... what is "SO"?
I thought that was Shockingly Obvious....
😎
Or Seriously Overrated.
Seriously.....doesn't even begin to grasp it. There are of course some very good contributors there but (excuse the pun) seriously, the level of noise and animal dropping like substance answers is far too high.
😎
No kidding. I figured I would setup an account and venture around a bit but wow. I never realized how shockingly bad most sql people are. My SSC shaded glasses have led me to believe that most people have a clue...wow!!!
I stay away from that site as far as I can (at least when it comes to answering questions...)
The problem is that sometimes I see shockingly bad answers, but I cannot downvote them as I don't have enough "reputation".
And the attitude of some people over there...
When I have .NET issues though, 90% of the time I find my solution on SO.
In other words SO's SQL isn't the brightest bulb araound:w00t:
😎
Maybe 😀
I don't have enough .NET knowledge to know if an answer is crap or not 🙂
I'm just happy if it works.
Need an answer? No, you need a question
My blog at https://sqlkover.com.
MCSE Business Intelligence - Microsoft Data Platform MVP
July 26, 2014 at 3:14 am
Koen Verbeeck (7/26/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/26/2014)
Koen Verbeeck (7/26/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Jeff Moden (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
Sorry for my ignorance... what is "SO"?
I thought that was Shockingly Obvious....
😎
Or Seriously Overrated.
Seriously.....doesn't even begin to grasp it. There are of course some very good contributors there but (excuse the pun) seriously, the level of noise and animal dropping like substance answers is far too high.
😎
No kidding. I figured I would setup an account and venture around a bit but wow. I never realized how shockingly bad most sql people are. My SSC shaded glasses have led me to believe that most people have a clue...wow!!!
I stay away from that site as far as I can (at least when it comes to answering questions...)
The problem is that sometimes I see shockingly bad answers, but I cannot downvote them as I don't have enough "reputation".
And the attitude of some people over there...
When I have .NET issues though, 90% of the time I find my solution on SO.
In other words SO's SQL isn't the brightest bulb araound:w00t:
😎
Maybe 😀
I don't have enough .NET knowledge to know if an answer is crap or not 🙂
I'm just happy if it works.
I've seen some utterly horrid .NET (and almost anything else also) answers, the problem is exactly what you said earlier, most of the time one cannot down-vote the bad answers. The good thing about SSC is that when I make blunders I am immediately told off:pinch:
😎
July 26, 2014 at 7:48 am
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/26/2014)
...
I've seen some utterly horrid .NET (and almost anything else also) answers, the problem is exactly what you said earlier, most of the time one cannot down-vote the bad answers. The good thing about SSC is that when I make blunders I am immediately told off:pinch:
😎
That still happens to me at times. 😉
July 26, 2014 at 8:21 am
Koen Verbeeck (7/26/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/26/2014)
Koen Verbeeck (7/26/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/25/2014)
Jeff Moden (7/25/2014)
Sean Lange (7/25/2014)
WOW!!! If you have ever wondered about the quality of responses at SO just checkout this response to a question about when it is appropriate to use NOLOCK.Most banking applications can safely use nolock because they are transactional in the business sense. You only write new rows, you never update them.
Sorry for my ignorance... what is "SO"?
I thought that was Shockingly Obvious....
😎
Or Seriously Overrated.
Seriously.....doesn't even begin to grasp it. There are of course some very good contributors there but (excuse the pun) seriously, the level of noise and animal dropping like substance answers is far too high.
😎
No kidding. I figured I would setup an account and venture around a bit but wow. I never realized how shockingly bad most sql people are. My SSC shaded glasses have led me to believe that most people have a clue...wow!!!
I stay away from that site as far as I can (at least when it comes to answering questions...)
The problem is that sometimes I see shockingly bad answers, but I cannot downvote them as I don't have enough "reputation".
And the attitude of some people over there...
When I have .NET issues though, 90% of the time I find my solution on SO.
In other words SO's SQL isn't the brightest bulb araound:w00t:
😎
Maybe 😀
I don't have enough .NET knowledge to know if an answer is crap or not 🙂
I'm just happy if it works.
Sadly a lot of .net people only use SO even to find their answers for SQL and then treat it as gospel truth. A lot of it is not very good. But the BS around rep just sucks. I can't even answer a question because I haven't first posted my own question. Why would I want to post a question just to get rep so I can eventually answer a question?
Just like the sun shines on a dogs rear-end, you will occasionally find a decent answer for SQL on SO.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
July 26, 2014 at 1:14 pm
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/26/2014)
The good thing about SSC is that when I make blunders I am immediately told off:pinch:
:Whistling:
Gail Shaw
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server, MVP, M.Sc (Comp Sci)
SQL In The Wild: Discussions on DB performance with occasional diversions into recoverability
July 26, 2014 at 1:55 pm
GilaMonster (7/26/2014)
Eirikur Eiriksson (7/26/2014)
The good thing about SSC is that when I make blunders I am immediately told off:pinch::Whistling:
Didn't take long :blush:
Thanks!!!
😎
July 26, 2014 at 3:52 pm
SQLRNNR (7/26/2014)
But the BS around rep just sucks.
That might be where the word "Overflow" comes from. 😛
--Jeff Moden
Change is inevitable... Change for the better is not.
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