September 19, 2012 at 9:26 am
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?
September 19, 2012 at 9:27 am
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Stefan Krzywicki (9/19/2012)
SQLRNNR (9/19/2012)
Grant Fritchey (9/19/2012)
Nothing wrong with this maintenance plan. I mean, everything is covered:1. Check DB Integrity
2. Back Up Db Full
3. Back up Db transaction log
4. Shrink Db
5. Rebuild index
6. Update statistics
7. Reorganize Index
8. Clean up history
9. maintenace clean up task ( which will dlete the .bak and .trn files which are older than 3 days.
Face.... palm... repeat vigorously.
I just encountered two doing the exact same thing - both on the same server running at the same time...:crazy:
Now THAT is thorough!
I'm sorry, but is there a specific thread where this is happening?
No, it's on the other web site.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood"
- Theodore Roosevelt
Author of:
SQL Server Execution Plans
SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
September 19, 2012 at 9:31 am
Grant Fritchey (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Stefan Krzywicki (9/19/2012)
SQLRNNR (9/19/2012)
Grant Fritchey (9/19/2012)
Nothing wrong with this maintenance plan. I mean, everything is covered:1. Check DB Integrity
2. Back Up Db Full
3. Back up Db transaction log
4. Shrink Db
5. Rebuild index
6. Update statistics
7. Reorganize Index
8. Clean up history
9. maintenace clean up task ( which will dlete the .bak and .trn files which are older than 3 days.
Face.... palm... repeat vigorously.
I just encountered two doing the exact same thing - both on the same server running at the same time...:crazy:
Now THAT is thorough!
I'm sorry, but is there a specific thread where this is happening?
No, it's on the other web site.
Oh, okay. I was just curious. I won't go there. I like this one.
September 19, 2012 at 9:33 am
Grant Fritchey (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Stefan Krzywicki (9/19/2012)
SQLRNNR (9/19/2012)
Grant Fritchey (9/19/2012)
Nothing wrong with this maintenance plan. I mean, everything is covered:1. Check DB Integrity
2. Back Up Db Full
3. Back up Db transaction log
4. Shrink Db
5. Rebuild index
6. Update statistics
7. Reorganize Index
8. Clean up history
9. maintenace clean up task ( which will dlete the .bak and .trn files which are older than 3 days.
Face.... palm... repeat vigorously.
I just encountered two doing the exact same thing - both on the same server running at the same time...:crazy:
Now THAT is thorough!
I'm sorry, but is there a specific thread where this is happening?
No, it's on the other web site.
Mine isn't. But if you think about it for 2 seconds you might know where it is happening (well Grant would anyway since we talked about it this past weekend).
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
September 19, 2012 at 9:42 am
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?
Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
September 19, 2012 at 9:51 am
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
It will certainly solve the problem of being at a job too long once something really bad happens. :w00t:
Seriously are they so clueless to think that a simple hint will fix everything? If so, why doesn't MS just make ALL queries like that and save them the keystrokes? Good luck with that one.
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September 19, 2012 at 9:58 am
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
Well, you know, you will get to say I told you so the first time a critical report has erronous information as a result of the use of WITH NOLOCK.
September 19, 2012 at 11:09 am
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
Well, you know, you will get to say I told you so the first time a critical report has erronous information as a result of the use of WITH NOLOCK.
One does not say such demeaning words in a team-oriented environment where success is shared, blame is not apportioned, and mistakes are looked upon as learning experiences.
Not to mention it's a quick career-killer, especially given my reputation for unapologetic bluntness.
September 19, 2012 at 11:13 am
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
Well, you know, you will get to say I told you so the first time a critical report has erronous information as a result of the use of WITH NOLOCK.
One does not say such demeaning words in a team-oriented environment where success is shared, blame is not apportioned, and mistakes are looked upon as learning experiences.
Not to mention it's a quick career-killer, especially given my reputation for unapologetic bluntness.
At least you can say "Now we've learned that WITH NOLOCK is not good for data integrity."
--------------------------------------
When you encounter a problem, if the solution isn't readily evident go back to the start and check your assumptions.
--------------------------------------
It’s unpleasantly like being drunk.
What’s so unpleasant about being drunk?
You ask a glass of water. -- Douglas Adams
September 19, 2012 at 11:15 am
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
Well, you know, you will get to say I told you so the first time a critical report has erronous information as a result of the use of WITH NOLOCK.
One does not say such demeaning words in a team-oriented environment where success is shared, blame is not apportioned, and mistakes are looked upon as learning experiences.
Not to mention it's a quick career-killer, especially given my reputation for unapologetic bluntness.
Well, I wouldn't use those exact words either. I would definately try to be more diplomatic. But truth be told, that is exactly how I would feel.
September 19, 2012 at 11:17 am
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
Well, you know, you will get to say I told you so the first time a critical report has erronous information as a result of the use of WITH NOLOCK.
One does not say such demeaning words in a team-oriented environment where success is shared, blame is not apportioned, and mistakes are looked upon as learning experiences.
Not to mention it's a quick career-killer, especially given my reputation for unapologetic bluntness.
I'd say it. And yes, it limits my options too, but I don't see why our "team learning" means we all have to act like the dumbest, most ignorant person in the room as a baseline. How about the "team" learn from the people with slightly less ignorance?
Yeah, I know, I'm going to HR again. Yes, I know the way...
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood"
- Theodore Roosevelt
Author of:
SQL Server Execution Plans
SQL Server Query Performance Tuning
September 20, 2012 at 1:56 am
Sean Lange (9/19/2012)
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
It will certainly solve the problem of being at a job too long once something really bad happens. :w00t:
Seriously are they so clueless to think that a simple hint will fix everything? If so, why doesn't MS just make ALL queries like that and save them the keystrokes? Good luck with that one.
They do, if you want.
IMLE, encouraging a wayward developer to read the BOL section relevant to this setting can help to wean them off NOLOCK.
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
September 20, 2012 at 2:17 am
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
How about suggesting you test Read Committed Snapshot Isolation as a compromise? Then readers don't block writers and vice versa and everyone gets a consistent result set.
To be honest, you can balls up a critical report in Read Committed if an index key column is updated at the wrong moment.
September 20, 2012 at 3:02 am
HowardW (9/20/2012)
How about suggesting you test Read Committed Snapshot Isolation as a compromise?
That's the path I'm trying to take here. First of all though I need to show what the impact on the TempDB is, so we can work out if it will give any of our customers a problem.
One more thing to add to a long, long list of projects.
However, on the plus side at least they let me 'play' with things like this. I've learned a lot over the past few years and spread the knowledge.
September 20, 2012 at 4:18 am
HowardW (9/20/2012)
Brandie Tarvin (9/19/2012)
Lynn Pettis (9/19/2012)
Do you ever feel that no matter how many times you tell someone what the problem may be that they just aren't listening?Yep.
My current drama is trying to ban WITH NOLOCK() at my workplace. Unfortunately, certain influential people like that particular hint (because it solves ALL problems), which means my ban is pretty much doomed to failure. @sigh.
Ah, well. I live to battle another day.
How about suggesting you test Read Committed Snapshot Isolation as a compromise?
It's an idea, but I may get lynched for suggesting changes in database settings. Two of the excuses I foresee are "thiings have been working fine since SQL 2000, so why change anything?" and "these systems aren't the financial systems of record, so why worry about committed data?" There are other considerations that I can't seem to convince anyone are legitimate considerations.
So what I need to do is find an example of proving NOLOCK() will screw with the data, but tailor that example to fit our systems and our data so they see the horror of what they're trying to do. If it's just sample data, it won't have the same impact. If it's our data, it should (I hope) make them reconsider.
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