October 18, 2010 at 9:01 pm
Stefan,
Feel free to stand on the sidelines while everyone else throws stones.
October 18, 2010 at 9:03 pm
I'm with Lynn. I'm not sold that global warming, even if it is happening, is a bad thing. It might be part of a long cycle of the Earth. My vote is that we don't know enough about how the Earth works.
That doesn't mean we shouldn't look to be more efficient with natural resources, but we shouldn't go crazy and look at it as the sky is falling.
October 18, 2010 at 9:19 pm
Stefan Krzywicki (10/18/2010)
You know, I'm not going to. I don't want to get into political arguments here. I shouldn't have said anything at all, but I'm not feeling well and I responded when I shouldn't. I want this to be a forum where I can banter with other SQL Server professionals in a friendly manner and I'm going to stay out of any political anything. I'd appreciate it if other people would as well, you can always start another thread to go on about this stuff.
If I'm wrong or out of line for suggesting that as well, that's unfortunate.
First, I see and understand your point of view. Most political discussions end up in flames. However, I truely believe that most of Threadizens are professional individuals who can keep their discussions factual. By not getting into rational political discussions, we are actually depriving each other of a vital part of politics, open and frank discussion of the issues. The problem we are faced with is that everything gets truncated in30 second sound bites, how can you have an actual discussion in that short of a time?
The true key to a successful political discussion comes down to two main areas, facts not emotions, and knowing when to agree to disagree. You aren't always going to convince some one that you are right or vice a verse.
I can still remember a time, many years ago when my mom and her friend were having a heated debate between Nixon and McGovern. At one point in the argument my cousin got so frustrated she said "That's not fair, you are using facts!"
I personally am not ready to get into the discussion as I still feel that the facts just aren't there either way. As I indicated earlier, I believe that this issue as become to politicalized with the politicians saying that the facts are in and it is happening. Really? Just because they say so? There is just too much on each side of the issue that it is really hard to know at this time.
October 18, 2010 at 10:00 pm
Lynn Pettis (10/18/2010)
I can still remember a time, many years ago when my mom and her friend were having a heated debate between Nixon and McGovern. At one point in the argument my cousin got so frustrated she said "That's not fair, you are using facts!"
Now that is just hilarious!
Wayne
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server 2008
Author - SQL Server T-SQL Recipes
October 18, 2010 at 10:12 pm
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (10/18/2010)
I'm with Lynn. I'm not sold that global warming, even if it is happening, is a bad thing. It might be part of a long cycle of the Earth. My vote is that we don't know enough about how the Earth works.That doesn't mean we shouldn't look to be more efficient with natural resources, but we shouldn't go crazy and look at it as the sky is falling.
Lynn Pettis (10/18/2010)
I personally am not ready to get into the discussion as I still feel that the facts just aren't there either way. As I indicated earlier, I believe that this issue as become to politicalized with the politicians saying that the facts are in and it is happening. Really? Just because they say so? There is just too much on each side of the issue that it is really hard to know at this time.
I agree with Lynn that the facts are not in. Steve is also absolutely right in that we do need to conserve our natural resources, be efficient with them. We also need to minimize our pollution - we have a long way to go with this. We also need to greatly enhance alternative energy sources. However, the energy companies are against this - it will totally rock their bottom lines, so they are fighting it politically every step of the way. Can you imagine every house with their own solar panels and solar collectors to generate, from the sun, all the hot water and the vast majority of the electricity that they need? Can you imagine the power grid, as we know it, being reduced to supplying energy to houses during times when the sun isn't shining or supplementing energy during times of peak usage?
Personally, I believe that weather goes in cycles. This is something that my grandfather / great-grand-father instilled in us. We haven't been keeping weather records long enough to know whether this is accurate or not - we need several hundred years of records to know this, and we barely have one hundred. I also believe that this whole global warming stuff is all politicalized - and as usual, they are full of, well, hot air (to be nice about it).
Wayne
Microsoft Certified Master: SQL Server 2008
Author - SQL Server T-SQL Recipes
October 18, 2010 at 10:25 pm
WayneS (10/18/2010)
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (10/18/2010)
I'm with Lynn. I'm not sold that global warming, even if it is happening, is a bad thing. It might be part of a long cycle of the Earth. My vote is that we don't know enough about how the Earth works.That doesn't mean we shouldn't look to be more efficient with natural resources, but we shouldn't go crazy and look at it as the sky is falling.
Lynn Pettis (10/18/2010)
I personally am not ready to get into the discussion as I still feel that the facts just aren't there either way. As I indicated earlier, I believe that this issue as become to politicalized with the politicians saying that the facts are in and it is happening. Really? Just because they say so? There is just too much on each side of the issue that it is really hard to know at this time.I agree with Lynn that the facts are not in. Steve is also absolutely right in that we do need to conserve our natural resources, be efficient with them. We also need to minimize our pollution - we have a long way to go with this. We also need to greatly enhance alternative energy sources. However, the energy companies are against this - it will totally rock their bottom lines, so they are fighting it politically every step of the way. Can you imagine every house with their own solar panels and solar collectors to generate, from the sun, all the hot water and the vast majority of the electricity that they need? Can you imagine the power grid, as we know it, being reduced to supplying energy to houses during times when the sun isn't shining or supplementing energy during times of peak usage?
Personally, I believe that weather goes in cycles. This is something that my grandfather / great-grand-father instilled in us. We haven't been keeping weather records long enough to know whether this is accurate or not - we need several hundred years of records to know this, and we barely have one hundred. I also believe that this whole global warming stuff is all politicalized - and as usual, they are full of, well, hot air (to be nice about it).
I also believe we should start construction of 4th generation nuclear power plants. From what I have read about Thorium powered reactors, this is a way to go and reduce our dependency on coal and gas powered plants. It also appears that these types of reactors would make excellent candidates for contruction projects in many other countries. It appears to me, and I'll need to do more reading to be sure, but these plants don't produce the toxic by-products our older plants produce, nor do they produce the weapons grade materials to build nuclear weapons.
October 19, 2010 at 12:36 am
Alvin Ramard (10/18/2010)
Paul White NZ (10/18/2010)
CirquedeSQLeil (10/18/2010)
Why is Green the color to represent tree huggers and eco-friendly?Which colour makes more sense to you? Pink?
I'd rather it be mauve. 😀
Oh no, not mauve, not in these times ... People would start to think being nature friendly may hurt their children :blink:
Johan
Learn to play, play to learn !
Dont drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ...
but keeping both feet on the ground wont get you anywhere :w00t:
- How to post Performance Problems
- How to post data/code to get the best help[/url]
- How to prevent a sore throat after hours of presenting ppt
press F1 for solution, press shift+F1 for urgent solution 😀
Need a bit of Powershell? How about this
Who am I ? Sometimes this is me but most of the time this is me
October 19, 2010 at 1:15 am
Tom.Thomson (10/18/2010)
The Dixie Flatline (10/18/2010)
I once heard two brothers argue (inconclusively) about whether or not black and white were colors. Opinions anyone?The right way to get a safe answer is to ask your wife, or if you don't have one of those, ask your sister, or your mother, or your girlfriend, or your sister in law, or your best friends girlfriend. If you don't have any of those you are not entitled to know the answer.
My wife was wrong once. She had said something earlier that she now thought was wrong, but she was right...
October 19, 2010 at 1:59 am
Wow! All these negative vibes :pinch:
I come in this morning and the thread has gone serious :angry:
Now I have to find a dark room to lay down and contemplate a higher plane of existence :w00t:
Far away is close at hand in the images of elsewhere.
Anon.
October 19, 2010 at 2:03 am
David Burrows (10/19/2010)
Wow! All these negative vibes :pinch:I come in this morning and the thread has gone serious :angry:
Now I have to find a dark room to lay down and contemplate a higher plane of existence :w00t:
That should be the pink room or the green room .... according to my shrink :w00t:
Johan
Learn to play, play to learn !
Dont drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ...
but keeping both feet on the ground wont get you anywhere :w00t:
- How to post Performance Problems
- How to post data/code to get the best help[/url]
- How to prevent a sore throat after hours of presenting ppt
press F1 for solution, press shift+F1 for urgent solution 😀
Need a bit of Powershell? How about this
Who am I ? Sometimes this is me but most of the time this is me
October 19, 2010 at 2:11 am
Paul White NZ (10/18/2010)
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (10/18/2010)
Jason (10/18/2010)I think most trees are brown on the outside with a topcoat (needles or leaves) that may or may not be green.
Tell that to any kid. They all drawn a brown trunk, topped with green. Ask them what color a tree is and you'll get "green" back.
I used to know a Miss Green, first name Theresa.
I therefore insist that trees are green, or that stops being funny.
Noooooooooo
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
October 19, 2010 at 2:22 am
GSquared (10/18/2010)
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (10/18/2010)
Alvin Ramard (10/18/2010)
Jeff Moden (10/17/2010)
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (10/14/2010)
The green value, if there is one, comes not from you getting ebooks, but from 1000s of people doing this. Less paper, less energy, less storage, not to mention less trucking, heating, cooling, etc. That being said, not sure this is the best way to remain green, especially as you have to charge it up.Doesn't bode well for lots of jobs, and I hope that some level of "bookstore" still remains in the future.
I wonder what the total carbon footprint of manufacturing such a device is? Add the carbon footprint of recycling it at end of life.
To get the true green value of ereaders, you also have to factor in how many books did not get printed. Good luck with that number.
Printed, shipped, stored (heated), shipped back, destroyed, trash/burning, fuel, etc. It's a slippery slope. Going down the path of arguing every bit of carbon footprint is a little silly, right now. We have not idea of current carbon footprints, so it doesn't make sense to just start arguing about new products that change the way we do things.
I wouldn't argue for e-readers on the portion of them being green. I go for the convenience.
Arguing about "carbon footprint" is baseless in any case. There is exactly zero scientific evidence that atmospheric CO2 does anything except stimulate plant growth.
The models that "prove" otherwise have all been debunked. They start out with an atmosphere with uniform density and infinite thickness, which happens to be impossible as well as incorrect. Take out those two data, and the "heating" disappears into the signal-to-noise ratio. Check out Freeman Dyson's data on that. It matters.
The models used in atmospheric photochemistry, a module of Environmental Chemistry I took at Uni in 1978, were multilayered. Back then the scare was refrigerants and spray-can propellants, and some of the oxides of nitrogen from internal combustion engines.
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
October 19, 2010 at 2:26 am
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (10/18/2010)
I'm with Lynn. I'm not sold that global warming, even if it is happening, is a bad thing. It might be part of a long cycle of the Earth. My vote is that we don't know enough about how the Earth works.That doesn't mean we shouldn't look to be more efficient with natural resources, but we shouldn't go crazy and look at it as the sky is falling.
Fine words, couldn't agree more.
Something which is often downplayed or even missed entirely is the role the oceans play in maintaining our atmosphere. It's massively more significant than terrestrial plants.
Edit: fixed typo.
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
October 19, 2010 at 2:30 am
WayneS (10/18/2010)
Steve Jones - SSC Editor (10/18/2010)
I'm with Lynn. I'm not sold that global warming, even if it is happening, is a bad thing. It might be part of a long cycle of the Earth. My vote is that we don't know enough about how the Earth works.That doesn't mean we shouldn't look to be more efficient with natural resources, but we shouldn't go crazy and look at it as the sky is falling.
Lynn Pettis (10/18/2010)
I personally am not ready to get into the discussion as I still feel that the facts just aren't there either way. As I indicated earlier, I believe that this issue as become to politicalized with the politicians saying that the facts are in and it is happening. Really? Just because they say so? There is just too much on each side of the issue that it is really hard to know at this time.I agree with Lynn that the facts are not in. Steve is also absolutely right in that we do need to conserve our natural resources, be efficient with them. We also need to minimize our pollution - we have a long way to go with this. We also need to greatly enhance alternative energy sources. However, the energy companies are against this - it will totally rock their bottom lines, so they are fighting it politically every step of the way. Can you imagine every house with their own solar panels and solar collectors to generate, from the sun, all the hot water and the vast majority of the electricity that they need? Can you imagine the power grid, as we know it, being reduced to supplying energy to houses during times when the sun isn't shining or supplementing energy during times of peak usage?
Personally, I believe that weather goes in cycles. This is something that my grandfather / great-grand-father instilled in us. We haven't been keeping weather records long enough to know whether this is accurate or not - we need several hundred years of records to know this, and we barely have one hundred. I also believe that this whole global warming stuff is all politicalized - and as usual, they are full of, well, hot air (to be nice about it).
Dendrochronology gives us a weather timeline going back - IIRC - a couple of tens of thousands of years. The granularity isn't great but it's something. Trees grow quickly when conditions are good resulting in thicker growth rings than when conditions are not so favourable.
For fast, accurate and documented assistance in answering your questions, please read this article.
Understanding and using APPLY, (I) and (II) Paul White
Hidden RBAR: Triangular Joins / The "Numbers" or "Tally" Table: What it is and how it replaces a loop Jeff Moden
October 19, 2010 at 2:38 am
That timeline was indeed overwelming in "An Inconvenient Truth"
Johan
Learn to play, play to learn !
Dont drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ...
but keeping both feet on the ground wont get you anywhere :w00t:
- How to post Performance Problems
- How to post data/code to get the best help[/url]
- How to prevent a sore throat after hours of presenting ppt
press F1 for solution, press shift+F1 for urgent solution 😀
Need a bit of Powershell? How about this
Who am I ? Sometimes this is me but most of the time this is me
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