SSWUG is it a real USER GROUP or not ??
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As an Oracle DBA as well as a SQL DBA I am a memebr of many different groups. One such Oracle group sent out the follwoing.
Don Burleson
There is a lot of discussion this week about the "SQL Server Worldwide Users Group (SSWUG) and their practice of charging $9 to see free Oracle articles.
Many folks are disgusted because of alleged fraud by the web site owner. For example, last week the site stated that Oracle's Tom Kyte is their "technologist" and they are selling links to Kyte's tips. Read the whole story here:
http://oracle-tips.c.topica.com/maacUpWabb3alceZO1Mb/
Have a read and I would be very interested in what your opinions are...
Thanks
Hope this helps...
Ford Fairlane
Rock and Roll Detective
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The defense for this was that SSWUG were acting as a collation service so that all relevant links were present within their site. There is something to be said for that and if people are prepared to pay for it then that is their business.
There may be copyrighting issues with what SSWUG are doing.
If work that I had donated was being bought and sold without my knowledge I would be pretty pissed off. It would be contrary to the whole spirit in which I donated the work.
The least SSWUG should do is to offer Tom Kyte et al a cut of the proceeds either directly or to a charity of choice.
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I don't want to comment on the article or SSWUG, but they are not a user group. They are a for profit business.
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When I first became a SQL DBA, SWYNK.com was THE website to go to for help, reference, scripts, etc. I spent a lot of time there, and gained a lot of knowledge. When Mr. Wynkoop began charging real $$$ for access, I left. I figured that there are other sites out there that I can get the same service from without paying. Lo and Behold, I found SQLServerCentral.com! I’ve never looked back. However, in January of this year, I was looking for a solution to a problem that I had. I did a Google search and found SSWUG, and they appeared to have the answer to my problem. I paid ‘em the $15.00 admission fee and got the shirt. To me, the fact that Mr. Wynkoop was involved was an added bonus. However, it didn’t take long to realize that it wasn’t truly a worldwide user’s group, but rather a similar venture to SQYNK.com, only without the content. I was extremely disappointed, and never went back. Chalked up my $15 investment as a lesson.
Steve
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When I started searching for sites, I also came across SSWUG. The fact that they charge money ruled it out for me. Same for PASS International. Though I co-founded PASS Germany recently. But that's at no fee. And once that will change, I'll leave.
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Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
Oh, I forgot.
As for Oracle: Who needs other sites than asktom or mailing lists than orafaq?
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Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
Its a bit off topic but a similar problem exists if you are trying to sell open-source solutions.
Firstly, open-source is mistakenly seens as "free" software.
Secondly, if the software is cheap it is very hard to sell the idea that customizing it can cost serious money.
Back onto the subject of web sites; they have to be paid for somehow. This site has gone with the sponsorship and advertising route and, thank God, it seems to be enough to ensure the survival of the site.
Unless you have a niche site I cannot see how you can get people to pay for information that is easily (and I stress easily) found elsewhere. SQL Server and ORACLE could never be called niche products.
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SSWUG was initially created by Stephen Wynkoop on his web site, http://www.swynk.com. It was. at the time, the best source of information about SQL Server. Low and behold, one day it suddenly turned into a pay site. I'm not sure that Wynkoop has anything to do with it any more.
It's not worth the fee, especially since the best SQL Server site (http://www.sqlservercentral.com) on the web is still free!
Michael John
Michael L John
If you assassinate a DBA, would you pull a trigger?
To properly post on a forum:
http://www.sqlservercentral.com/articles/61537/ -
Well, I was about to post that Mr. Wynkoop's picture is on the start page of SSWUG, but I see that he has moved it to the "About SSWUG" page. Yes, Stephen Wynkoop is not only involved in SSWUG, he IS SSWUG.
Steve (not Wynkoop)
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Well one can only speculate that he sold out... I have this mental picture of someone whispering in his ear one grogy night "... just imagine how much money we'll, ummm, you'll make!"
In "Pattern Recognition" by William Gibson, one of his characters mumbles: "I think it's about the money for him... Ultimately I find that that was the whole problem, with most of the dot-com people."
Don't want to get into any moral discussions here only that I think he nailed that one on the head. Personally (and I know that I'M compleeetly different from everyone else
) I do it because of the prestige, I mean challenge.Also I don't see why I should pay for something that I can get from BOL, dev or technet, the scripts and the community are what do it here.
Cheers and hohoho
Max
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I personally think of SWYNK as the forerunner of SSWUG. I used to write for SWYNK some time ago, and you used to get good support, quite a lot of freedom from a web site design perspective, and some sweet little payments every month. Not something to retire on or do anything really apart from the odd beer maybe, but nice all the same, One day it all changed. No notice, no payments either, just nothing. I believe SWYNK was sold. The great monolith of quality internet publishing Internet.com now appears to own all SWYNK content. Content was butchered, or migrated depending on your perspective, over to databasejournal.com. Formatting was broken, downloads were lost, and my name was still at the top, but don't worry my email address was soon removed, as obviously this was a sign of the good old days.
At the end of the day I don't have a problem with someone selling their site, but communication costs almost nothing with email, and it has made me consider what I publish through which channels. Saying that you wouldn't have SSC if it wasn't for SWYNK or at least the "restructure" of it as Brian so tactfully puts it. I think of that as a good thing
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