Saving User Groups
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Is there anything that can be done to save user groups? Or are they outdated in the Internet age?
Give us your suggestions and ideas.
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At its peak Orlando had 15 attendees, averages a lot less now. I think the .Net group has 30-50 attendees per meeting. That's from metro Orlando, not the smallest city trying to support a user group.
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Hard to tell. I'm really unsure about the meaning behind user groups right now. I suspect them to be kinda outdated for information retrieval, but it is fun to actually see the people I talk with in the German newsgroup. However, here in the chapter of PASS Germany I visit I think most people use them only to do networking.
This is not what I like and this is not what I will support if it doesn't change.--
Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
...forgot to add.
It might be a German specific phenomenon, but it's even hard to build up a German SQL Server online community, it will be much harder to establish a running SQL Server offline community in the long run. We we founded PASS here, I think there qere quite a few people who just jumped on the train, just to be able to say to their clients: Hey, I'm a founding member of PASS Germany, the only MS recognized community!
I'm really curious how many clients were deeply impressed by this "marketing effect". After all, those guys *must* have superior knowledge. How could they otherwise have been privileged to found such an association
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Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
I think a lot of it is networking. Which to me should be a part of the agenda, but not the main part.
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Never been to one, honestly, I don't even know that one exists in the Jersey area.
The whole networking aspect is an interesting thing that I know Monster.com has been looking towards building.
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Not sure I'd give up an evening to talk about SQL Server although, with a young family, time is precious.
I agree that net resources from both Microsoft, user groups and others are excellent, possibly they are hastening the demise of the user group. The net even offers discussion groups and threads as a modified form of human interaction.
To be honest, I'd see networking (human that is) as the main benefit of joining a user group.
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Okay, networking is to a certain degree a necessary evil (to me). Most of the folks here who joined PASS seem to be self-employed lone fighters. For them it is kinda essential to get contacts. That's okay as long as it isn't the only purposes for them to join. It should stay focused on the topic. Another annoying thing is being contacted by sales people (you know who you are
) to sponsor the meal or something else at those meetings.<rant mode on>
Wtf, do you think you are, dude?
I am well able to pay for my meal myself. If I ever need a presentation for something, I call you. If I don't call you, you should be able to conclude that I don't need anything you sell. But be sure, if I ever need a clown, you'll be on my top list to call.</rant mode off>
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Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
I think the biggest reason user groups die quickly after starting so greatly is the amoutn of time people have to give up in order to participate. They have to feel like they are getting a lot back out of it or it just istn't worth it. I think this is why they generally break down into networking session. The key is that folks have to get value they fell fairly compensates their time. Many don't go to them to participate themselves they want a sppon feed session where they can pick up new things and new toys. It is this fact that many fail because their aren't enough contributors. I mean that is even the case here on SQL Server Central, if the user base didn't contain enough contributors then it would have failed, but unlike user groups it can tap millions of potential folks and the data is retained much better as there is a quick way to save it and reference after the fact, many users groups don't provide the material in a good source after it is presented.
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No! I really don't think so!
I think people join such groups in order to get entertained, educated and things like that for *free*. They only want to consume passively. No community will work this way. It's a give and take to and from everyone. When there are more people who want to take instead of give, the community is doomed to die. if it is the other way round, well, that community is fortunated.
Consider the people who contribute here on SSC. Compared to those more than 200,000 who registered it is a *very* small amount of people who give, and the vast majority who takes. Sad, but true.
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Frank Kalis
Microsoft SQL Server MVP
Webmaster: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs
My blog: http://www.insidesql.org/blogs/frankkalis/[/url] -
I attended a few user groups sessions (in Chicago) with the idea of getting information and ideas--maybe getting answers to problems I was working, maybe giving answers to others problems. (To me, "networking" means "getting information on job opportunities".) Getting free pizza was a bonus (but not a big one, given the pizzeria
), and raffle handouts were Ok. Over time things devolved to sponsored sesssions focusing on vendor products (including Microsoft), and the return on my time invested went away.The one thing I can think of that might create a "sustainable" users group is the social angle. What if you showed up because your friends were there, because it was a good time? At some level this has to be a factor. Is there some kind of camaraderie, or does everyone sit and wait for the speach to start? I posit that if you have a core group at the start that's more or less willing to "take in" strangers, you've got a chance to make it work. [I'm minded of wild tales I heard from the old Foxpro Devcon days. Wish I'd have been there...] The fact that companies hire hoards of developers but only one or two DBAs (but check me on that) may have an impact on this.
As an infrequent lurker, I'd like to offer a last two cents on the subject of SSC contributors. I generally don't have the time to check in every day, and less so the opportunity to chip in with advice. However, whenever I do have a problem that I hope someone can help with, I always spend some time looking for topics that I can help with. Sort of like "giving something back" for the help I get. BUT, I don't (and shouldn't) give too much, because my informed opinions are limited and few. I've stopped checking listserves where the most frequent contributors were not the most competent ones... which is definitely not the case here at SSC.
Philip
(Used the puke smiley in proper context! Another space on my Bingo card filled.)
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I can report that there are at least some user groups that are still thriving. The Los Angeles SQL Server Professionals Group (http://www.sql.la) has been meeting monthly since Sep 2003 (average attendance about 30). And the Los Angeles .NET Developers Group (http://www.ladotnet.org/), with nearly 1,500 registered members, has been meeting monthly since Jan 2001 (average attendance about 75). Aside from networking, members are attracted by great speakers/presentations for almost nothing (usually $5 admission), many raffle prizes such as books and software, and freebies such as magazines. All of that requires a lot of work by the group leadership to maintain a consistent level of sponsorship by local companies, as well as national entities such as Microsoft, INETA, and publishers.
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My 2c worth, I was a memebr of the SS-SIG in Perth but I left after it started to go way off topic, and well was of no real interest to me anymore or any of the other DBA's I know to have attented the meetings. I find it more informative to be apart of something like sqlservercentral then some UG that goes off in the wrong direction...
Hope this helps...
Ford Fairlane
Rock and Roll Detective
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I find interpersonal meeting and discussion to be much more effective than searching the internet. More often than not, I have a problem that is a bit different than results returned from the internet and I cannot always determine where the difference is. Anyway, I wish there were more interested people. I just joined the Philly user group and hopefully I can attend most of the meetings.
Regards,Dave Doyle
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